Logs on 2021-02-07 (freenode/#haskell)
| 00:00:41 | <monochrom> | I think the flawed logic stemmed from mistaking Haskell classes for Java classes. |
| 00:01:29 | <monochrom> | (And s/Java classes/Java interfaces/ doesn't save it.) |
| 00:01:52 | <monochrom> | The fact remains that 99.9% of the time, Java classes/interfaces translate to Haskell types. |
| 00:02:14 | <monochrom> | and likewise Java objects translate to Haskell terms. |
| 00:03:45 | <shachaf> | What Java interfaces translate to Haskell types, rather than type classes? |
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| 00:04:50 | <shachaf> | Hmm, not every Haskell function of that type is a natural transformation. But that probably doesn't matter. |
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| 00:07:56 | <ski> | Java interfaces are object types. Java classes are Java interfaces, plus a particular implementation, plus the ability to have implementation inheritance and open recursion (and type-case) |
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| 00:09:37 | <ski> | (in Haskell terms, the implementation would correspond to an operation that returns a record) |
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| 00:12:42 | <dolio> | Which functions don't qualify? seq stuff? |
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| 00:54:18 | <zeta_0> | what's the name of the ghc channel? I need some help with building ghc with nix. |
| 00:54:36 | <maerwald> | #ghc |
| 00:55:58 | <zeta_0> | thanks |
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| 01:00:10 | <zeta_0> | ok, I posted the issue in #ghc, I almost got it working, I think I just need to get past this 1 bash error. |
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| 01:03:15 | <zeta_0> | my tooling setup (direnv+nix-direnv+emacs-direnv) is amazing for working in isolated environments, but ghc.nix(https://github.com/alpmestan/ghc.nix) does not like it for some reason. |
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| 01:36:07 | <zeta_0> | maerwald: do you know when's the best time to ask questions in #ghc? I don't want to be stuck waiting for hours to get a response. |
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| 01:36:53 | <maerwald> | zeta_0: I think European time zones |
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| 01:40:06 | <zeta_0> | maerwald: thanks |
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| 01:43:36 | <zeta_0> | that: `is a directory` error that bash is throwing is very vague. |
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| 02:17:33 | <h2017> | hi |
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| 02:19:39 | <lemmih> | h2017: hi. |
| 02:19:54 | <h2017> | hi lemmih |
| 02:20:04 | <h2017> | does anyone know where i can see the implentation of liftIO? |
| 02:21:18 | <lemmih> | h2017: For which monad? liftIO has many different implementations. Much like how 'show' has many different implementations. |
| 02:21:50 | <h2017> | ok i'll find out |
| 02:22:05 | <lemmih> | h2017: For the IO monad, liftIO = id. |
| 02:22:11 | <h2017> | i made a monad transformer that will often have IO as the base monad |
| 02:22:19 | <h2017> | it doesn't get liftIO for free? |
| 02:22:49 | <lemmih> | h2017: Perhaps you can derive MonadIO. |
| 02:23:07 | <h2017> | so I need to make it an instance of MonadIO? |
| 02:23:35 | <lemmih> | Yes. liftIO is a member of MonadIO. In fact, it's the only member. |
| 02:23:54 | <lemmih> | The documentation is here: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/transformers-0.3.0.0/docs/Control-Monad-IO-Class.html#t:MonadIO |
| 02:24:08 | <h2017> | thanks. can i apply the same techniques to substittue IO for the writer monad? |
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| 02:25:22 | <lemmih> | Probably. Depends on your monad transformer. |
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| 02:25:44 | <koz_> | Yeah, what's your transformer (stack?) look like? |
| 02:26:06 | <h2017> | ok i see how it fits together now |
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| 02:26:31 | <h2017> | liftIO = lift . liftIO, so liftIO must be id for the IO monad |
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| 02:27:37 | <h2017> | limmih not specified yet. I made a monad transformer, and I'd like to use liftIO with it, and now I believe that I can, and it would be good it i could also use a writer (and it looks like i could do that too using the same tricks they use to implent liftIO) |
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| 02:35:51 | <h2017> | in a monad transformer i can make use of things like lifting, and liftIO is especially useful. For the Free monad, is there there a any kinf od FreeT transformer. (BTW I don't know how that work work, if it even makes sense) |
| 02:36:05 | <h2017> | oh i see it in hoogle |
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| 02:43:08 | <h2017> | how often do people use free monads? it looks useful bit I don't think you can have things like guard and mzero, without building them into your language and interpreting them |
| 02:43:40 | <h2017> | for that reason i think i think it preferable to not use the Free monad when you can use a straight up monad. |
| 02:44:11 | <h2017> | a straight up monad that has those things already |
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| 02:45:32 | <koz_> | Basically, _start_ without free. |
| 02:45:37 | <h2017> | even if you use liftIO output statements inside the free monad won't be that meaningful because all that's happening is a syntax tree is being built. |
| 02:45:45 | <koz_> | It can be useful, but it has non-trivial tradeoffs which you probably don't need to make. |
| 02:45:46 | <h2017> | freeT monad i mean |
| 02:46:07 | <koz_> | And to even explain what these are is not particularly easy. |
| 02:46:20 | <koz_> | If you're having to ask about liftIO, this is _definitely_ not somewhere you wanna delve. |
| 02:48:49 | <h2017> | on the webpage https://stackoverflow.com/questions/4063592/how-can-i-write-a-state-monad-that-does-error-handling-as-well |
| 02:49:09 | <h2017> | the second answer has a monad that I am interested in |
| 02:49:09 | <koz_> | StateT Either is a perfectly fine solution. |
| 02:49:17 | <koz_> | So is ExceptT State. |
| 02:49:21 | <koz_> | Depending on what you want. |
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| 02:50:15 | <h2017> | is the monad described in the first example of the second answer available in any library? |
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| 02:50:43 | <h2017> | i'll paste it to pastebin so everyone knows which one i'm talking about |
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| 02:50:58 | <ski> | @where paste |
| 02:50:58 | <lambdabot> | Help us help you: please paste full code, input and/or output at eg https://paste.tomsmeding.com |
| 02:52:06 | <h2017> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/xU9gJXkg |
| 02:52:27 | <koz_> | h2017: That's quite literally StateT s Either a |
| 02:52:35 | <koz_> | You can build that out of transformers. |
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| 02:52:45 | <koz_> | StateT s (Either e) a, sorry. |
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| 02:54:56 | <ski> | (it also has redundant brackets. `(StateMonad p) >>= k = ...' could be `StateMonad p >>= k = ...', and `let (StateMonad q) = ...' could similarly be `let StateMonad q = ...') |
| 02:55:28 | <ski> | ®unmtl StateT MyState (Either e) a |
| 02:55:34 | <ski> | @unmtl StateT MyState (Either e) a |
| 02:55:34 | <lambdabot> | MyState -> Either e (a, MyState) |
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| 03:59:21 | <guest7682358928> | Hello everyone. Is this a good place for asking newbie questions? |
| 04:00:11 | <dsal> | guest7682358928: Generally want to start with the question you want to ask. :) |
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| 04:01:39 | <koz_> | Yeah, just ask. If we need to direct you somewhere else or whatnot, we can do that. |
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| 04:03:48 | <guest7682358928> | thanks. I'm trying to wrap my head around types in aeson. Basically I just want to parse a json file of format {"images": [{"uri": "file1.txt"}, {"uri": "file2.txt"}], ...} to a list of strings. This is what I end up at the moment: |
| 04:04:15 | <koz_> | @where paste |
| 04:04:15 | <lambdabot> | Help us help you: please paste full code, input and/or output at eg https://paste.tomsmeding.com |
| 04:04:23 | <koz_> | In case you want to paste code. |
| 04:05:03 | <dsal> | guest7682358928: What do you want your list of strings to look like? |
| 04:05:31 | <guest7682358928> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/FhjwWWOb#file-1 |
| 04:06:01 | <guest7682358928> | dsal: I want a ```Just ["file1.txt", "file2.txt"]``` |
| 04:06:10 | <guest7682358928> | i'm sorry not very familiar with irc |
| 04:06:26 | <dsal> | It's alright. aeson-lens makes that pretty easy. |
| 04:06:30 | × | nhs quits (~nhs@c-24-20-87-79.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 04:06:40 | <dsal> | Most of the time, when I'm doing stuff with aeson, I either have structures that represent what I want, or I use aeson-lens |
| 04:06:54 | <dsal> | (er, lens-aeson) |
| 04:07:42 | <dsal> | (my dev stuff is currently broken, so I've got to wait for stuff to build here) |
| 04:08:22 | <glguy> | guest7682358928, Do you know how to do it and you're looking for a nice way, or you'd just like a way to do it at all? |
| 04:09:59 | <guest7682358928> | dsal: I saw a handful of examples with lenses that make it look almost as short as typescript, but I'm afraid lenses are just too advanced feature for me yet. I have no idea what happens under the hood. |
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| 04:10:57 | <guest7682358928> | glguy: I already did it as I shown in the paste above, but I don't like the fact it took 9 lines of code, I believe Haskell is about short and neat solutions. |
| 04:11:05 | × | conal quits (~conal@64.71.133.70) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 04:11:09 | <glguy> | OK, let's clean it up just using aeson then |
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| 04:13:11 | <guest7682358928> | I saw functions like withObject and withArray that seem to help me, but they need "Parser a" as the last parameter and my type puzzle breaks apart |
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| 04:14:44 | <ski> | `sequence $ flip fmap xs $ \x -> ..x..' is `for xs $ \x -> ..x..' |
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| 04:16:21 | <dsal> | If you created a type with a String field named Uri, and another type with a field named Images with a list of those, aeson could mostly derive the parsers for you. |
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| 04:17:55 | <guest7682358928> | ski: that's useful, thank you |
| 04:19:23 | <guest7682358928> | dsal: that would be even more code. two types with Generics machinery for such a simple thing. I think it's time to get familiar with lenses. |
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| 04:20:06 | <glguy> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/0FzOAGJd |
| 04:20:15 | <glguy> | You get something like this doing the typeclass-driven approach |
| 04:21:26 | <glguy> | *Help> decode "{\"images\": [{\"uri\": \"file1.txt\"}, {\"uri\": \"file2.txt\"}]}" :: Maybe Images |
| 04:21:26 | <glguy> | Just (Images [Image "file1.txt",Image "file2.txt"]) |
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| 04:23:22 | <dsal> | guest7682358928: It's not necessarily golf. Sometimes it's not writing code unnecessarily. |
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| 04:25:00 | <dsal> | Lens is generally useful, but it's effectively another language. |
| 04:25:18 | <glguy> | Prelude Data.Aeson.Lens Control.Lens> toListOf (key "images" . values . key "uri" . _String) "{\"images\": [{\"uri\": \"file1.txt\"}, {\"uri\": \"file2.txt\"}]}" |
| 04:25:18 | <glguy> | ["file1.txt","file2.txt"] |
| 04:25:52 | <dsal> | Oh man, mine had almost finished compiling… |
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| 04:28:18 | <guest7682358928> | dsal glguy ski: thank you for your help, I'll keep playing with this |
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| 04:52:36 | <koz_> | Is there a reason why 'words' (from text) and 'split isSpace' (again from text) produce different results? |
| 04:52:58 | <koz_> | (by which I mean 'philosophically' not 'implementationally' of course) |
| 04:53:17 | <koz_> | (or rather, 'philosophical reason' not 'implementational reason') |
| 04:53:31 | <glguy> | Is the difference that words will eat multiple spaces? |
| 04:53:54 | <koz_> | glguy: Yes. |
| 04:54:10 | <glguy> | then I'd say the difference is that words doesn't consider the empty string a word |
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| 04:54:32 | <glguy> | while split is about breaking up some text on an arbitrary delimiter |
| 04:54:56 | <koz_> | However, split (== '\n') and lines _are_ equivalent. |
| 04:55:12 | <glguy> | I'd be surprised if they were |
| 04:55:26 | <koz_> | http://hackage.haskell.org/package/text-1.2.4.1/docs/src/Data.Text.html#lines |
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| 04:55:52 | <glguy> | lines should treat \n as a line TERMINATOR while split would treat as a separator |
| 04:56:47 | <glguy> | Prelude Data.Text> Data.Text.lines "a\nb\n" |
| 04:56:47 | <glguy> | ["a","b"] |
| 04:56:47 | <glguy> | Prelude Data.Text> Data.Text.split ('\n'==) "a\nb\n" |
| 04:56:47 | <glguy> | ["a","b",""] |
| 04:56:56 | <koz_> | Interesting. |
| 04:57:03 | <glguy> | of course an empty *line* makes plenty of sense |
| 04:57:03 | <koz_> | Didn't think of the trailing newline. |
| 04:57:13 | <glguy> | so lines returns those |
| 04:57:49 | <glguy> | > words "prelude works the same way" |
| 04:57:50 | <lambdabot> | ["prelude","works","the","same","way"] |
| 04:57:59 | <glguy> | > lines "and\nhas\nterminators |
| 04:58:01 | <lambdabot> | <hint>:1:29: error: |
| 04:58:01 | <lambdabot> | <hint>:1:29: error: |
| 04:58:01 | <lambdabot> | lexical error in string/character literal at end of input |
| 04:58:02 | <glguy> | > lines "and\nhas\nterminators\n" |
| 04:58:04 | <lambdabot> | ["and","has","terminators"] |
| 04:58:24 | <koz_> | Ah, OK, makes sense. |
| 04:58:27 | <koz_> | Thanks! |
| 04:58:30 | <glguy> | ^_^ |
| 04:59:35 | <koz_> | So does this mean that, in general, unlines . lines /= id, and unwords . words /= id? |
| 05:00:04 | <glguy> | > (unlines . lines) "a\nb" |
| 05:00:07 | <lambdabot> | "a\nb\n" |
| 05:00:21 | <glguy> | > (unwords . words) "you're right" |
| 05:00:22 | <lambdabot> | "you're right" |
| 05:00:30 | <koz_> | OK, definitely good to know. Thanks! |
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| 05:01:08 | <glguy> | there are enough broken text files in the wild that it would be annoying if lines fell over when the final terminator was missing |
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| 05:01:51 | ski | . o O ( s;/=;=/=; ) |
| 05:02:08 | <koz_> | ski: Yes, I was being a bit abusive of notation there. |
| 05:02:24 | <koz_> | Because technically functions don't have Eq instances. |
| 05:02:32 | ski | nods and smiles |
| 05:02:42 | <glguy> | ≠ ? |
| 05:02:47 | <ski> | works for me |
| 05:02:56 | <glguy> | Gives an excuse for me to use a digraph |
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| 05:03:25 | <ski> | (i'm also .. annoyed, by people who write `===', when `=' would work as well) |
| 05:03:33 | <koz_> | ski: PHP lol. |
| 05:03:44 | <ski> | no, i'm talking about Haskell docs, Haskell blags |
| 05:04:15 | <glguy> | ski, I think if I was doing that it would be because I wanted to be clear I wasn't using the Haskell = at that point but it was a meta-level thing |
| 05:05:36 | <ski> | oh, you mean, equal as expressions ? |
| 05:05:48 | <ski> | like how `2 * 3' and `1 + 5' are not the same expression |
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| 05:06:44 | <glguy> | yeah, probably that |
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| 05:06:45 | <koz_> | Something something intro to Girard's book where he opines on 'but what does = _really_ mean?'. |
| 05:06:54 | ski | grins |
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| 05:14:08 | <monochrom> | === is more equal than == |
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| 05:14:51 | <glguy> | == is a question |
| 05:14:55 | <glguy> | 1 == 2 |
| 05:15:03 | <glguy> | Turns out that evaluates to False |
| 05:16:11 | <koz_> | glguy: I would hope so. |
| 05:16:47 | <monochrom> | I was joking. |
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| 05:17:26 | <monochrom> | But I can argue "= is just as much a question as ==" another day. |
| 05:17:41 | <ski> | a different type of question |
| 05:18:12 | <ephemient> | ≟ |
| 05:18:21 | <glguy> | but which one is a riddle? |
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| 05:19:01 | <ski> | (one is suggesting "Calculemus !", the other is suggesting "scratch head, and think, and maybe get an answer in half an hour, or a year, or five hundred years") |
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| 05:20:05 | <ephemient> | ⯹ |
| 05:20:19 | <ephemient> | (why does Unicode have these symbols) |
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| 05:20:50 | <monochrom> | It has emoji, it can have any symbol. |
| 05:21:21 | <glguy> | I think they flip a coin each time they have an idea and this is how we have a partial superscript/supscript alphabet |
| 05:22:38 | <frankdmartinez> | My apologies if this is the wrong forum. I am trying to build ghc-vis and I get a complaint about ghc-heap-view which says “This library cannot be built using profiling. Try invoking cabal with the --disable-library-profiling flag.” It seems, wherever I place that option, cabal gives the same complaint. Can anyone point me in the direction of information on how to build ghc-heap-view with this flag (or, preferablt, ghc-vis)? |
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| 05:29:07 | <glguy> | frankdmartinez, this is an OK place to ask, but I'm not sure if anyone knows off the top of their head, so you might have to give more detail about what commands you're trying and the actual output |
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| 05:39:28 | <frankdmartinez> | glguy: Thanks, good point. Initial command tried: `cabal install ghc-vis --allow-newer`. The log from that attempt can be found at https://pastebin.com/a60pRq0Z. I have tried placing `--disable-library-profiling` after `cabal` as well as after each argument passed to it and, though the path to the temporary files mentioned changes each time, the error about trying to build using profiling remains the same. |
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| 05:40:53 | <glguy> | I'm not sure. It doesn't look like this package's dependencies are particularly maintained at the moment |
| 05:41:09 | <glguy> | There was some recent commit activity I found on the ghc-vis github |
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| 06:15:32 | <frankdmartinez> | glguy: I think I got it. I had “library-profiling” set to “True” in the ~/.cabal/config file. I changed it to “False” and cabal is moving muuuuuuuch further along. |
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| 07:43:33 | <hololeap> | Elm is weird. it's like Diet Haskell |
| 07:44:33 | <siraben> | ugh Elm recursion has to be bounded otherwise it blows the stack |
| 07:44:57 | <siraben> | witness how they define foldr https://github.com/elm/core/blob/22eefd207e7a63daab215ae497f683ff2319c2ca/src/List.elm#L173 |
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| 07:46:21 | <hololeap> | that's ... strange |
| 07:46:43 | <hololeap> | how am i supposed to write an 'until' loop? lol |
| 07:47:15 | <c_wraith> | My experience with Elm and talking to other people who have used Elm leads me to believe that if you haven't used Haskell, you'll like it. |
| 07:47:31 | <c_wraith> | If you have, you just wonder why everything is so hard |
| 07:47:51 | <hololeap> | yeah, people on the elm reddit are like, how can you just magically make an enumeration over a sum type? |
| 07:48:00 | <hololeap> | and i'm flipping tables |
| 07:48:51 | <hololeap> | (╯° °）╯︵ ┻━┻ |
| 07:49:04 | <siraben> | `derive Enum` |
| 07:49:39 | <hololeap> | what do you mean i have to hard code the isomorphism to int?? |
| 07:49:39 | <siraben> | also because of a lack of typeclasses there's a lot of passing around of dictionaries |
| 07:50:18 | <hololeap> | yeah and no Ord so you get a handful of valid key types for dicts |
| 07:51:00 | <siraben> | last time I used Elm for a work project perf was also a pain point, there's no good sequence library like in Haskell |
| 07:51:39 | <siraben> | and if only we had laziness so we don't need to compute over tens of thousands of elements |
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| 07:53:51 | <hololeap> | luckily i found a good library for enums and dict that will take any type of key given a way to convert it to an int |
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| 08:00:48 | <siraben> | hololeap: which library? |
| 08:01:02 | <siraben> | also list fusion and deforestation are non-existent in Elm, IIRC |
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| 08:02:31 | <hololeap> | Herteby/enum and turboMaCk/any-dict |
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| 08:12:30 | <ski> | hm, reminds me of how i read in some old Prolog implementations, they commonly did iteration by binary recursion. the reason was that the stack depth was limited (and apparently there was no LCO) but if your call-tree was a binary tree, your depth would be logarithmic rather than linear |
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| 08:13:27 | <ij> | more data is disappearing from my POSet than there should be. I cannot replicate it with the same data in REPL. Where could the bug be? http://sprunge.us/eLgYzn |
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| 08:22:24 | <ij> | in running the application the one cursor = (0,5) disappears, which you can verify by search-highlighting "(0,5)" |
| 08:23:35 | <ij> | I guess I could isolate all the additions/deletions and see if I can produce the bug in REPL then |
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| 08:24:09 | <ski> | i guess `Show' isn't consisted with `toList' |
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| 08:24:23 | <ski> | s/consisted/consistent/ |
| 08:24:58 | <ski> | (there's no `removeMin' ?) |
| 08:25:24 | <ij> | well, you can only remove an unordered group, because it's a poset |
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| 08:25:33 | <ij> | smallest unordered group |
| 08:26:08 | <ij> | POSet.toList says its order is unspecified |
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| 08:27:13 | <ski> | hm, ok |
| 08:27:45 | <ski> | but calling `toList' clearly gives a different result than using `Show' |
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| 08:28:51 | <ski> | (and it looks like all your cursors in the list are distinct, wrt the given equality) |
| 08:29:10 | <ij> | fmap cursor, just to make it easier for looking through and so I'd have to format less, but I have macros anyway, so: http://sprunge.us/WiZKEV |
| 08:29:19 | <ski> | (or, i suppose s/cursors/continues/) |
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| 08:30:58 | <ski> | hm, so where does `continues' come from ? |
| 08:30:58 | <ij> | the order is still off, but that could be because it was created differently in the program |
| 08:31:05 | <ski> | probably, yea |
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| 08:32:18 | <ski> | could you try calling `fromList' from the snippet of code using `print' to check that you're getting the same items, there ? |
| 08:32:31 | <ski> | er, sorry. calling `toList' |
| 08:33:47 | <ij> | https://github.com/siers/ppmz/blob/master/solve.hs |
| 08:34:06 | <ij> | addNextContinues/findContinue |
| 08:34:18 | <ij> | I'll try that, one sec |
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| 08:37:35 | <ski> | (oh, and your `Show' instances really should be defining `showsPrec', not `show') |
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| 08:38:30 | <ij> | I don't think I understand what you're asking me – print where? did you notice the last URL? – I printed the unabbreviated versions. or would you like to see something else? |
| 08:39:23 | <ski> | i guess around lines 426 through 428 |
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| 08:39:52 | <ski> | what if you also do |
| 08:40:09 | <ski> | print ("continues",S.toList continues) |
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| 08:40:33 | <ski> | print ("continues",S.toList (S.delete (head (S.lookupMin continues)) continues)) |
| 08:40:37 | <ij> | aha |
| 08:40:39 | <ski> | around there ? |
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| 08:41:16 | <ij> | oh, you meant toList up there |
| 08:41:17 | <ski> | to check whether `Show' and `toList' actually does display the same items present |
| 08:41:22 | <ski> | yea |
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| 08:42:45 | <ij> | http://sprunge.us/wl83Gq |
| 08:42:53 | <ski> | btw, `foo <- pure bar' can be replaced by `let foo = bar' |
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| 08:43:36 | <ij> | that's only for aesthetical syntactical homogeneity |
| 08:43:39 | <ski> | ij : is that if you added `S.toList' to the existing lines ? |
| 08:43:53 | <ij> | print ("continues", S.toList continues) AND print ("= ", S.toList (S.delete (head (S.lookupMin continues)) continues)) |
| 08:44:12 | <ij> | right? |
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| 08:44:22 | <ski> | yea .. i was really asking for that, in *addition* to the previous lines |
| 08:44:30 | <ski> | (to more easily be able to compare) |
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| 08:44:53 | <ij> | more log from the application run? |
| 08:45:00 | <ski> | however .. it looks like there's still one item missing |
| 08:45:06 | <ski> | (log ?) |
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| 08:46:06 | <ij> | oh, from lines with the context, I guess? if so, then one sec |
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| 08:46:32 | <ski> | (i'm not sure what you're asking) |
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| 08:46:58 | <ij> | you wanted to switch between tabs and compare, so I think I understand what you're asking for |
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| 08:47:23 | <ski> | i dunno what either "tabs" or "compare" means |
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| 08:49:25 | <ij> | http://sprunge.us/So256p |
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| 08:50:05 | <ij> | this format is diffable with the previous post and you can see that S.toList produces the same output as Show POSet :) |
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| 08:50:39 | <ski> | hm, ok |
| 08:50:56 | <ij> | (I didn't just delete the `fromList's, I did indeed copy and reformat) |
| 08:51:25 | <ski> | (although you didn't copy and reformat the lines with `S.toList') |
| 08:52:03 | <ij> | the lines 426-428? |
| 08:52:23 | <ski> | not those line numbers in the paste, but yea |
| 08:52:30 | <ski> | (but it doesn't really matter much) |
| 08:52:44 | <ij> | yes, this is the output after adding S.toList in the prints |
| 08:53:48 | <ski> | i dunno how `POSet' works really. i suppose you're either failing some precondition of an operation in the lib .. or maybe hitting on a bug in it |
| 08:54:12 | <ij> | scores aren't the same and it works as expected in isolation |
| 08:54:35 | <ij> | I think it's a bug, but I cannot be sure until I have extracted a clean example |
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| 08:54:58 | <ij> | going to print all the modifications, try it out in ghci then |
| 08:55:18 | <ski> | if you're able to figure out in which order the continues are actually added to the poset, you could then try to play around with a program containing just those insertions, and see if you could reduce the problem then |
| 08:55:38 | <ij> | yup, that's what I was trying to say :) |
| 08:55:51 | <ij> | shouldn't be too difficult |
| 08:56:43 | <ski> | perhaps you could even use QuickCheck or SmallCheck or something like that, to generate lists of instructions to perform on a POSet, and get a (local) minimum example |
| 08:57:48 | <ij> | given that I have a running example already, I think printing a ton of S.insert, S.deletes will be quite faster to get a quick "bug"/"no bug" in POSet answer |
| 08:58:33 | <ij> | I could also accidentally lose the bug, if I change anything, so I may not be able to create an example |
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| 08:59:54 | <ij> | when I knew I'll have to use another set library, I had a hunch it likely won't go smoothly |
| 09:00:01 | <ij> | it never does 😅 |
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| 09:47:25 | <ij> | ski, vote bug! http://sprunge.us/UmyV79 |
| 09:50:30 | <ij> | context for anyone reading: Continue { cursor = (0,5), score = 15 } is never deleted, but it goes missing after adding Continue { cursor = (2,2), score = 14 } though the partial order doesn't consider them the same |
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| 10:37:22 | <ij> | here's a shorter example with (0,5) disappearing http://sprunge.us/lxrnaj |
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| 10:38:34 | <ij> | can someone verify that the XY (0,5) 15 shouldn't disappear? |
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| 10:48:35 | <f-a> | hello. On which repo can I report a suggestion/bug about the windows installer (chocolatey)? |
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| 10:54:15 | <Uniaika> | f-a: you should contact the chocolatey maintainer directly, you'll have more success |
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| 10:57:23 | <f-a> | thanks Uniaika, I should have been clearer |
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| 10:57:40 | <ij> | ski, mind taking a look? |
| 10:57:48 | <f-a> | numerous windows users I know (well, few windows users I know) do not like chocolatey and are wary of installing it |
| 10:58:16 | <f-a> | I wanted to relay their feedback |
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| 10:59:18 | <Uniaika> | f-a: that's unfortunately in direct opposition with the fact that we don't have enough people that are knowledgeable enough to produce MSI packages (or whatever is the format nowadays) |
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| 11:00:43 | <f-a> | Uniaika: feedback I got said «My specific issue would be, what chocolatey did didn't seem to complicated. I would have done it myself if there were download links alongside the chocolatey version.» |
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| 11:08:44 | <Uniaika> | f-a: I hear you, but you will make things change for the better if you directly contact the Chocolatey maintainer |
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| 11:20:45 | <tomsmeding> | ij: is that library on hackage? |
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| 11:25:30 | <tomsmeding> | oh I see, it's pomaps |
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| 11:32:49 | <ij> | yup |
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| 12:14:22 | <jollygood2> | how do I convert char ** to [String]? do I have to loop over char ** and peekArray every char *? |
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| 12:19:16 | <merijn> | jollygood2: Yes |
| 12:19:38 | <merijn> | Why are you getting a char** to begin with, though? |
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| 12:20:56 | <jollygood2> | it's what the C function returns |
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| 12:22:10 | <merijn> | Ideally you'd want the C function to return something else, but if that's all you got, then yeah "loop over each element and convert the char*" is the best you can do |
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| 12:22:29 | <merijn> | Although you probably want one of the C string function, rather than peekArray |
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| 12:23:29 | <merijn> | There's peekCString for example, for NUL terminated strings |
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| 12:24:45 | <jollygood2> | yeah you're right, I wanted peekCString |
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| 12:27:27 | <jollygood2> | it worked. peekArray to convert char * to [char *], then mapM peekCString to get [String] |
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| 12:28:11 | <jollygood2> | to convert char ** to [char *], even |
| 12:30:44 | <merijn> | Yeah, that sounds about right |
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| 12:38:35 | <aveltras> | how would one use a function like https://hackage.haskell.org/package/typerep-map-0.3.3.0/docs/Data-TypeRepMap.html#v:keys ? I can't figure it out since you don't recover any type info |
| 12:39:09 | <merijn> | aveltras: When you pattern match on SomeTypeRep you bring the type info in scope |
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| 12:40:00 | <merijn> | aveltras: That applies to hiding type information with any existential |
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| 12:54:23 | <tomsmeding> | aveltras: related topic: GADTs |
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| 12:55:03 | <merijn> | tomsmeding: That's just because GADTs implicitly include existentials :) |
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| 12:55:53 | <tomsmeding> | certainly :) |
| 12:56:15 | <merijn> | I personally prefer just writing my existentials as GADTs anyway, more readable that way |
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| 12:56:43 | <merijn> | aww |
| 12:56:53 | <merijn> | GHC 9.0 doesn't have -XNoFieldSelectors yet? |
| 13:02:06 | <aveltras> | with the following |
| 13:02:10 | <aveltras> | https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/JBELuISb/ |
| 13:02:30 | <aveltras> | is there a way to make the pattern match work to extract valid content from the map ? |
| 13:02:34 | <aveltras> | i may be missing something here |
| 13:02:44 | <aveltras> | the second branch of the match is redundant |
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| 13:04:46 | <tomsmeding> | ij: in your second example ( http://sprunge.us/lxrnaj ), the deletion of XY (1,2) 13 already takes XY (1,3) 14 with it, which is incorrect as far as I can see |
| 13:05:19 | <merijn> | aveltras: The type annotation on line 13 doesn't make sense |
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| 13:05:33 | <merijn> | aveltras: You don't get to pick the type of the typerep |
| 13:05:46 | <merijn> | aveltras: You get "whatever happens to be in there" |
| 13:07:08 | <merijn> | aveltras: You probably wanna use == to compare that unknown typerep to whatever you want and then do something |
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| 13:09:22 | <merijn> | tbh, my initial response to this test code is "have you considered scrapping all this and *not* doing that?" :p |
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| 13:10:29 | <aveltras> | im already scraping something that's much more complicated :p |
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| 13:18:50 | <zebrag> | When one say that applicatives are amenable to static analysis. Does that mean that the compiler can help us there? Or does that mean we can do it with pen and paper? |
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| 13:19:48 | <zebrag> | (in my case that would be in relation with parsers) |
| 13:21:35 | <merijn> | zebrag: What people mean is this: |
| 13:21:38 | <merijn> | :t (<*>) |
| 13:21:39 | <lambdabot> | Applicative f => f (a -> b) -> f a -> f b |
| 13:21:46 | fendor_ | is now known as fendor |
| 13:21:56 | <merijn> | zebrag: Note how *both* the lest *and* right side of <*> are values of type 'f' |
| 13:22:30 | <merijn> | zebrag: If we consider the type 'f' "a description" of the side effects, this means that we know the exact effects of the left and right hand side of <*> without running anything |
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| 13:22:38 | <merijn> | zebrag: Now consider: |
| 13:22:42 | <merijn> | :t (>>=) |
| 13:22:44 | <lambdabot> | Monad m => m a -> (a -> m b) -> m b |
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| 13:23:08 | <merijn> | zebrag: Note how the right hand side is a function, which can use arbitrarily complex logic to decide what 'm b' to return |
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| 13:23:47 | <zebrag> | (I'm here) |
| 13:23:47 | <merijn> | zebrag: This means that we can't "inspect" the effects of the right hand side without first evaluating that function |
| 13:24:20 | <merijn> | zebrag: But to evaluate that function, we need to *first* get an 'a' to give to it, which we can only obtain by "executing" the effects on the left hand side-first |
| 13:24:36 | <maerwald> | zebrag: this may also be interesing: https://neilmitchell.blogspot.com/2019/10/monads-as-graphs.html |
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| 13:25:45 | <merijn> | zebrag: So, (depending on the actual applicative) <*> can (hypothetically) inspect and combine effects of both the left and right hand side in some meaningful way (like, running things concurrently in IO), which you cannot do with >>= |
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| 13:27:03 | <merijn> | zebrag: This actually highlight the difference in "power" of Monad and Applicative, with the 'a -> m b' of Monad we can have the exact effect we perform *depend* on the results of previous ones (the 'a'), with Applicative the *effects* are never conditional, only the result value is |
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| 13:28:18 | <zebrag> | merijn: okay, yes, I understand |
| 13:28:24 | <tomsmeding> | you can produce an AST of an entire applicative computation without any functions, whereas an AST of a monadic computation necessarily hides part of the structure behind a lambda |
| 13:28:33 | <zebrag> | maerwald: I'll look into it |
| 13:28:36 | <tomsmeding> | hence monadic computations aren't as amenable to static analysis :) |
| 13:29:06 | <merijn> | zebrag: So the "static analysis" people refer to is the part where you can write an <*> that optimises things using knowledge about effects from "both sides" |
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| 13:30:01 | <merijn> | Which naturally leads us to Selective Functors ;) |
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| 13:31:34 | <merijn> | zebrag: The Selective Functors paper from 2019 discusses the "static analysis" power of Applicative and Monad (and how this leads to the idea of Selective functors), it's an interesting read: https://eprints.ncl.ac.uk/file_store/production/258640/4FF2555F-0AEC-4876-9701-C83A3E5FFF52.pdf |
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| 13:35:00 | <zebrag> | There are very interesting quotes there, by the way: "Free Applicative Functors" https://arxiv.org/pdf/1403.0749.pdf, like this one "an applicative functor is just a functor that knows how to lift functions of arbitrary arities." |
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| 13:47:09 | tomsmeding | realises that you can replace <*> with 'liftedProduct :: f a -> f b -> f (a, b)' without any consequences |
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| 13:47:35 | <merijn> | define "any" and "consequences" :p |
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| 13:50:26 | <tomsmeding> | you can define <*> in terms of liftedProduct and vice-versa |
| 13:50:42 | <tomsmeding> | not talking about the lowly concerns of having to rewrite instances :p |
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| 13:51:19 | <merijn> | tomsmeding: Performance will probably change too :p |
| 13:51:20 | <tomsmeding> | and this equivalence between <*> and liftedProduct is precisely currying, in zebrag's quote that applicative functors can lift functions of arbitrary arities |
| 13:51:29 | <tomsmeding> | true :p |
| 13:51:46 | <tomsmeding> | well if you immediately apply (uncurry f), then it'll probably be optimised away |
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| 13:51:59 | <tomsmeding> | analogously to always using <*> in the form f<$>x<*>y |
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| 13:56:05 | <jil> | hello |
| 13:59:01 | <jil> | I'm rying to load function stored in different files in ghci. but what I tried up to now throughs an error module 'mail:Main' is defined in multiple files. |
| 13:59:48 | <jil> | I tried, :load file1.hs file2.hs and :load file1.hs :add file2.hs |
| 13:59:49 | <merijn> | jil: Are you loading a file and then loading it again? |
| 14:00:07 | <merijn> | ah, wait, you're loading two files |
| 14:00:22 | ← | f-a parts (~f-a@mi-18-14-238.service.infuturo.it) () |
| 14:00:28 | <merijn> | jil: If you don't have an explicit module name at the top, the compiler assumes/infers "module Main(main)" |
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| 14:00:44 | <jil> | ok |
| 14:00:49 | <merijn> | jil: So if neither of your files have a module name it's assuming both are Main and then complains :) |
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| 14:02:37 | <swarmcollective> | Is it possible to `import qualified` in ghci? |
| 14:03:11 | <geekosaur> | yes |
| 14:03:21 | <geekosaur> | but the semantics are different from :load |
| 14:04:59 | <swarmcollective> | The docs say "To make life slightly easier, the GHCi prompt also behaves as if there is an implicit import qualified declaration for every module in every package, and every module currently loaded into GHCi. This behaviour can be disabled with the -fno-implicit-import-qualified flag." However, that is somewhat confusing. |
| 14:05:53 | <swarmcollective> | The next section clarifies: https://downloads.haskell.org/~ghc/8.0.2/docs/html/users_guide/ghci.html#module-and-load |
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| 14:07:41 | <catalin> | Hello! I have problems installing hlint via cabal |
| 14:07:52 | <catalin> | I did `cabal install hlint` |
| 14:08:11 | <catalin> | I have a bunch of `/usr/bin/ld.bfd: cannot find -lHSexceptions` |
| 14:08:26 | <merijn> | Which OS? |
| 14:08:32 | <catalin> | Solus Linux |
| 14:09:04 | <merijn> | Never heard of it, do you have any haskell packages installed via the system package manager? |
| 14:09:23 | <catalin> | yes, a lot actually |
| 14:09:40 | <merijn> | oof |
| 14:09:41 | <catalin> | I have cabal, stack, ghc and many others |
| 14:10:08 | <merijn> | Sounds like your package manager has broken your package database |
| 14:10:24 | <merijn> | Leading cabal to think exceptions is installed, but the actual library being missing |
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| 14:10:49 | <catalin> | oh :( no idea how to regenerate it |
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| 14:15:07 | <jollygood2> | with parsec, how would I grab all the characters until the last character C in the input? |
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| 14:18:26 | <merijn> | manyTill or something like that |
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| 14:20:08 | <jil> | merijn: I'm not sure on how to declare a module. is it `module Main where ...` |
| 14:21:07 | <geekosaur> | module MyModule [(optionally exports here, otherwise everything is exported)] where |
| 14:21:28 | <geekosaur> | and "MyModule" must match the filename, including case, and start with initial uppercase |
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| 14:27:44 | <tomsmeding> | jollygood2: until the _last_ character C? That's annoying |
| 14:27:51 | <tomsmeding> | What's your purpose? |
| 14:28:06 | <jollygood2> | I'm rethinking the problem, I can probably do it a different way |
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| 14:29:24 | <jollygood2> | I'm trying to pass code to my program as an argument, so I'm manually parsing the argument string, instead of using getArgs, so that I don't have to escape " characters |
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| 14:30:26 | <tomsmeding> | jollygood2: you can't see the difference between me invoking your program as ./prog "a" or as ./prog a |
| 14:30:34 | <tomsmeding> | So that won't work I think |
| 14:31:00 | <jollygood2> | this is on windows, using powershell, so it adds several layers of mind fuck :) |
| 14:31:20 | <jollygood2> | good thing is, though, I can get unparsed string passed to my program, with all the quotes |
| 14:31:22 | <tomsmeding> | Ah I see |
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| 14:32:41 | <jollygood2> | is there a way to get that in *nix? if possible, I'd like to make my program work there as well |
| 14:33:04 | <tomsmeding> | In general, no, you can't get the command line as entered by the user on a unix-like system |
| 14:33:38 | <geekosaur> | the shell mangles it long before your program gets it |
| 14:33:40 | <tomsmeding> | The shell does lots of stuff, like evaluating command splices (e.g. ./prog $(echo hi)) |
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| 14:41:27 | <merijn> | Yes, I'll take "cursed question for 500, Alex" |
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| 14:46:44 | <merijn> | I propose the much better solution of "not doing that" >.> |
| 14:47:01 | <merijn> | If you wanna communicate code/whatever, you're better off doing it via stdin and/or a file anyway |
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| 14:50:48 | <jollygood2> | I was just thinking that myself a couple of minutes ago, maybe I should just pipe stdin to my program. as a bonus, it would double as a repl |
| 14:51:16 | <merijn> | jollygood2: tbh, for a REPL you probably wanna use something like haskeline so you get proper line-editing |
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| 14:55:14 | <futty> | I have been trying to implement a Huffman tree with the help of several modules and I'm a bit overwhelmed by this. I would be grateful if anyone could advice me how to proceed. https://repl.it/join/bwnnsmwu-futhark14 |
| 14:55:38 | <ephemient> | rlwrap is a cheap way to turn something accepting input on stdin into a repl |
| 14:55:52 | <ephemient> | you can get better results by integrating haskeline but it's more work |
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| 14:59:03 | <merijn> | ephemient: I switched to using haskeline for my input and it's pretty great, tbh :) |
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| 15:54:34 | <j2t> | Hi, why does a list have data constructors and a vector doesn't? |
| 15:54:52 | <merijn> | j2t: Vector has data constructors, they're just not publically exported |
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| 15:55:14 | <merijn> | j2t: All datatypes have constructors, but not every package *exports* those constructors |
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| 15:55:28 | <merijn> | Usually to stop users from touching stuff they shouldn't and breaking things |
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| 15:58:20 | <j2t> | merijn, thank, i see here `data Vector a = Vector {-# UNPACK #-} !Int` part of vector's data type definition. What is the unpack part? |
| 15:58:37 | <jollygood2> | main works fine, but why is main2 throwing that exception, and how would you prevent it if interact didn't exist? https://pastebin.com/jJBc8vuJ |
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| 15:59:25 | <geekosaur> | a pragma telling ghc not to put the following field in a box. (the field must be strict, hence the ! on it). this is invoking an internal optimization directly |
| 15:59:25 | <ij> | tomsmeding, yup, later noticed it and already added to the bug report |
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| 16:00:15 | <merijn> | j2t: Most data fields are boxed in GHC (that is, pointer indirection to the actual data), unpack makes GHC skip the indirection (which means it can't be lazy) |
| 16:02:53 | <tdammers> | merijn: what about Data.Void.Void? |
| 16:03:33 | <merijn> | tdammers: What about it? |
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| 16:05:51 | <j2t> | I hoogle list constructor `:` operator but search results don't show it. |
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| 16:06:26 | <fendor> | j2t, you have to put it in parathensis |
| 16:06:29 | <fendor> | @hoogle (:) |
| 16:06:29 | <lambdabot> | Data.Complex (:+) :: a -> a -> Complex a |
| 16:06:29 | <lambdabot> | Data.List.NonEmpty (:|) :: a -> [a] -> NonEmpty a |
| 16:06:29 | <lambdabot> | Data.Type.Equality data a :~: b |
| 16:06:37 | <geekosaur> | also it's wired into the compiler |
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| 16:06:57 | <merijn> | j2t: That's because it's built into the compiler |
| 16:07:02 | <geekosaur> | because list has to be special syntax for the [a,b,c] form |
| 16:07:05 | <j2t> | thanks |
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| 16:08:10 | <xsperry> | :t (:) |
| 16:08:11 | <lambdabot> | a -> [a] -> [a] |
| 16:08:14 | <xsperry> | :i (:) |
| 16:08:31 | <xsperry> | (works in ghc) |
| 16:08:34 | <xsperry> | ghci* |
| 16:09:16 | <geekosaur> | there's a dummy definition somewhere that exists only to provide an info table, as with other compiler built-ins |
| 16:10:59 | <geekosaur> | hoogle doesn't index the primitives/info table definitions, iirc, because its output would be too noisy with odd compiler built-ins with weird types/kinds |
| 16:11:55 | <tdammers> | merijn: you said every datatype has constructors, but Void doesn't |
| 16:11:59 | <catalin> | what is the difference between `doubleMe :: Num a => a -> a` and `doubleMe x = x + x` ? |
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| 16:12:11 | <catalin> | Beside the writing of it? |
| 16:12:19 | <merijn> | tdammers: That's recent, it used to have one in the past :p |
| 16:12:24 | <catalin> | the first is the signature? |
| 16:12:24 | <merijn> | tdammers: Also, educational lies :p |
| 16:12:40 | <tdammers> | merijn: well, it does have a type constructor |
| 16:12:46 | <merijn> | catalin: The first is the type signature, the second is the implementation |
| 16:13:00 | <catalin> | merijn: thank you |
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| 16:32:07 | <swarmcollective> | So far, I've used Web.Scotty for web api, but only for small projects (https://github.com/calledtoconstruct/kata-checkout-order-total/blob/master/haskell/item-api/Main.hs) Are there newer / better libraries? |
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| 16:39:16 | <swarmcollective> | (better is too subjective, but I'm interested in suggestions) |
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| 16:43:37 | <ph88^> | does anyone know how to debug root cause of hGetChar: end of file ? i already tried to do a profiling build with exceptions turned on https://bpa.st/XZ7YS |
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| 16:45:42 | <kuribas> | ph88^: is this hie? |
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| 16:51:05 | <jollygood2> | <jollygood2> main works fine, but why is main2 throwing that exception, and how would you prevent it if interact didn't exist? https://pastebin.com/jJBc8vuJ |
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| 16:54:23 | <merijn> | jollygood2: When you close stdin reads from stdin hit "end of file" |
| 16:54:55 | <merijn> | jollygood2: When you try and get a line from a file that has no more lines, what else can getLine do? |
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| 16:55:44 | <merijn> | jollygood2: You'll want to use try or catch from Control.Exception to catch the IOError and use https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.14.1.0/docs/System-IO-Error.html#v:isEOFError to check for EOF |
| 16:56:14 | <merijn> | jollygood2: Alternatively, you can check for EOF before every read |
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| 17:01:31 | <rndmprsn> | Anyone know any good URL/URI parsing libraries? I'm looking to parse something like ftp://username:password@example.com/home/foo into (Ftp Username Password Host Path) or similar |
| 17:01:57 | <rndmprsn> | I can always write my own but I'm wondering if there's an existing tool |
| 17:02:27 | <merijn> | Wasn't there one split of from network? |
| 17:02:53 | <merijn> | @hackage network-uri |
| 17:02:53 | <lambdabot> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/network-uri |
| 17:04:57 | <rndmprsn> | Oh, yeah there's parseURI then (uriScheme, uriAuthority, uriPath), ty |
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| 17:08:20 | <ph88^> | kuribas, what do you mean hie ? |
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| 17:11:28 | <swarmcollective> | Haskell IDE Engine (HIE) and it's newer sibling Haskell Language Server (HLS) assist the IDE with syntax highlighting, etc... |
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| 17:17:31 | <ph88^> | kuribas, swarmcollective it's this program https://github.com/wz1000/HieDb |
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| 17:19:17 | <swarmcollective> | ph88^ thank you. |
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| 17:20:29 | <ph88^> | don't think me, it's wz1000 :P |
| 17:20:32 | <ph88^> | thank * |
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| 17:34:44 | <shapr> | swarmcollective: we use servant at work for a 300,000 line codebase that's a bunch of different webapps |
| 17:35:00 | <shapr> | I use scotty for my small personal projects, but I'll likely switch to servant |
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| 18:05:23 | <ij> | can I fold/ tuples? |
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| 18:05:41 | <ij> | or iterate over them |
| 18:06:49 | <c_wraith> | what would the type of that be? |
| 18:07:26 | <monochrom> | How big is your tuple such that you have to ask? |
| 18:07:51 | <ij> | c_wraith, in this case, (a,a,a,a). monochrom, not big, fair enough. :) |
| 18:08:01 | <ij> | I just thought maybe it exists already |
| 18:08:23 | <c_wraith> | that's not the type of any iteration |
| 18:09:06 | <monochrom> | You can write your own fold, whatever it means. |
| 18:09:09 | <ij> | sorry, (a -> a) -> (a,a,a,a) -> a. I was trying to say it would only work for the same typed elements |
| 18:09:13 | <ij> | monochrom, guess so |
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| 18:10:31 | <swarmcollective> | shapr, thank you. I will look at servant. Much appreciated. |
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| 18:13:18 | <c_wraith> | > foldl1Of' each (+) (1,2,3,4) -- ij, as always, lens can do if only you pay a couple points of sanity |
| 18:13:20 | <lambdabot> | 10 |
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| 18:14:15 | <ij> | I remember seeing something like it in lens, but I think it was called "for" previously or I'm misremembering |
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| 18:14:55 | <hololeap> | there was a package that converted to/from (for instance) (a,a,a,a) <-> Finite 4 a (or something like that) |
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| 18:15:45 | <hololeap> | not Finite, but some sort of list with a size tag at the type level... |
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| 18:17:56 | <hololeap> | @hackage indexed-list-literals |
| 18:17:56 | <lambdabot> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/indexed-list-literals |
| 18:18:52 | <hololeap> | not quite how i described it, but close enough |
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| 18:31:26 | <fweht> | can someone explain to me the wildcard(?) notation in the type signatures from the ramda (js framework) documentation? |
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| 18:31:41 | <monochrom> | Wrong channel? |
| 18:31:52 | <fweht> | whats the difference between a → (* → a) (alawys in ramda) and a -> b -> a (const in haskell)? |
| 18:32:19 | <comerijn> | That sounds like a question for people involved in that framework? |
| 18:32:19 | <c_wraith> | who knows? this isn't a ramda channel |
| 18:32:38 | <fweht> | sorry |
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| 18:36:04 | <ij> | if I pass a value from an unboxed array to another function it will get boxed (if so, always)? what if I INLINE that function? or is that not easily answerable? |
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| 18:37:53 | <monochrom> | I think you should invest in learning core, cmm, and asm. |
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| 18:38:27 | <monochrom> | Because -ddump-prep -ddump-opt-cmm -ddump-asm will answer all your questions. |
| 18:38:38 | <ij> | I know what cmm refers to and I know asm, but not in-depth. What's core? |
| 18:38:58 | <ij> | I was wondering whether there's some intermediate format I could take a look at. |
| 18:39:08 | <comerijn> | ij: Core :p |
| 18:39:26 | <ij> | ok, found it |
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| 18:39:57 | <monochrom> | https://youtu.be/uR_VzYxvbxg is a good start. (But only a start.) |
| 18:40:29 | <ij> | sounds interesting, I hope I find the time for it |
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| 18:40:49 | <ij> | thank you |
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| 18:48:40 | <ij> | > let deleteGet = alterF (\a -> (a, Nothing)) () in deleteGet (M.fromList [((), 1)]) |
| 18:48:41 | <lambdabot> | error: |
| 18:48:41 | <lambdabot> | • Variable not in scope: |
| 18:48:41 | <lambdabot> | alterF :: (a1 -> (a1, Maybe a2)) -> () -> t1 |
| 18:48:46 | <ij> | > let deleteGet = M.alterF (\a -> (a, Nothing)) () in deleteGet (M.fromList [((), 1)]) |
| 18:48:48 | <lambdabot> | (Just 1,fromList []) |
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| 18:59:04 | <ij> | :t let deleteGetInt = M.alterF (\a -> (fold $ Sum <$> a, Nothing)); sumKeys = foldMap' deleteGetInt in sumKeys -- what a nice function |
| 18:59:06 | <lambdabot> | (Foldable t, Num a, Ord k) => t k -> M.Map k a -> (Sum a, M.Map k a) |
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| 19:03:41 | <shapr> | Anyone using Haskell to talk to serial ports? I'm curious if serialport is as cross-platform as it claims? |
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| 19:11:23 | <ephemient> | not using it, but looking at the source, it supports POSIX (using tty_ioctl) and Windows (GetCommState etc.) |
| 19:11:44 | <ephemient> | anything else you're concerned about being portable to? |
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| 19:14:26 | <shapr> | ephemient: I only need it on Linux and Mac |
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| 19:14:45 | <shapr> | Hopefully POSIX means it'll work on both of those. |
| 19:14:49 | <shapr> | time to find out! |
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| 19:32:16 | <comerijn> | Or it doesn't work on either, but in slightly different ways! :p |
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| 19:39:02 | <shapr> | I love the new feature in haskell-language-server where it creates a skeleton Show instances for a type, then one more click creates a pattern match for the constructors. |
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| 19:39:30 | <Uniaika> | shapr: I would love to be able to trigger that from neovim ;_; |
| 19:39:49 | <shapr> | I think the same features work from some flavor of vim? |
| 19:40:01 | <shapr> | I'm not a vim user, I can't help with that :-( |
| 19:40:17 | <Uniaika> | :) |
| 19:40:19 | <shapr> | but I know some of my coworkers do use haskell-language-server inside some flavor of vim. |
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| 19:49:58 | <ph88^> | is there any way to see what is new in a new stackage LTS release ? |
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| 19:58:00 | <koz_> | maerwald: I had 'ghcup compile ghc -v 8.10.4 -b 8.10.3' blow up on me due to a problem with autoreconf. |
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| 19:58:17 | <koz_> | Do you want anything besides the ghcup log? |
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| 20:13:44 | <ij> | ski, tomsmeding, it was indeed a bug in pomaps |
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| 20:16:01 | <tomsmeding> | Fortunately :) |
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| 20:16:25 | <ij> | https://github.com/sgraf812/pomaps/issues/3 |
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| 20:26:19 | <tomsmeding> | where is the hackagebot announcement :p |
| 20:26:50 | <sm[m]> | ph88^: isn't there a diff link somewhere on stackage.org ? |
| 20:27:04 | <ij> | tomsmeding, I haven't seen any today |
| 20:27:27 | <sm[m]> | it announces when it's in the mood |
| 20:27:52 | <tomsmeding> | earlier it was quite punctual, but as ij said it's been quiet today |
| 20:28:07 | <ph88^> | sm[m], eh ye i guess it would be possible to find a diff somewhere .. though not the same as a proper changelog :P |
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| 20:29:15 | <sm[m]> | I don't mean literally a diff, I seem to remember some kind of web page |
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| 21:15:37 | <ij> | any theoretical gains I get with POSet (because element deletion works unlike in Set) are negated by the performance of POSet :) well, it was worth a shot |
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| 21:30:38 | <shapr> | ephemient: I got it working https://github.com/shapr/bloohm |
| 21:31:59 | <ephemient> | 👍 |
| 21:32:48 | <ephemient> | I guess you have to use different device nodes on Linux vs macos (/dev/ttyUSB0 vs /dev/uc.usbserial or something), but that's outside of your program so it's all good :) |
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| 21:35:56 | <maerwald> | koz_: lemme try |
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| 21:36:58 | <shapr> | ephemient: yeah, I'll try this on my work mac tomorrow, see how it goes. |
| 21:37:20 | <shapr> | The library says the handle interface is experimental, I may need to switch to the stable interface. |
| 21:38:36 | <maerwald> | koz_: It's at ghc-make stage |
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| 21:38:42 | <maerwald> | so I'm suspecting autoconft succeeded? |
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| 21:40:43 | <koz_> | maerwald: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/BpTZCJpJ <-- short part |
| 21:40:48 | <koz_> | I'll beam you the whole log momentarily. |
| 21:42:35 | <koz_> | What's a good way to get you the whole ghc-make.log? |
| 21:42:38 | <koz_> | It's too big for a paste. |
| 21:43:09 | <Uniaika> | koz_: gist it? |
| 21:43:17 | <Uniaika> | you can upload a file directly |
| 21:43:53 | <koz_> | maerwald: https://gist.github.com/kozross/9b5dd81a461ab5cae818b83e4853c14c |
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| 21:46:33 | <tomsmeding> | koz_: sorry for the paste limit lol the VPS has a small disk |
| 21:46:50 | <koz_> | tomsmeding: No need to apologize. |
| 21:47:10 | <koz_> | I understand that there's no cloud, only other people's computers, and someone's gotta pay for them. |
| 21:47:46 | <tomsmeding> | <3 |
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| 22:20:23 | <justsomeguy> | Sometime I see the phrase "algebra" used to describe typeclasses, and I'm a little confused by it. Does an algebra mean a single operation and the set it operates on, or a collection of operations and the set they operate on? Also, do algebras need to conform to laws (or properties), or is that not a requirement to call something an algebra? |
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| 22:21:34 | justsomeguy | tried reading about it on wikipedia but the math jargon only confused him more. |
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| 22:23:31 | <pjb> | justsomeguy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algebra_(disambiguation)#Mathematical_structures |
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| 22:24:44 | <pjb> | justsomeguy: the number of operation will depend on the type of algebra on you type of values. |
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| 22:25:59 | <pjb> | justsomeguy: of course, you're not limitd to the structure that have been defined so far by mathematicians. Basically any set of operation on your types can be defined as AN algebra… |
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| 22:38:42 | <justsomeguy> | I guess I became confused when reading that there are multiple instances of Semigroup for the Sum and Product operations. |
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| 22:58:32 | <polyphem> | justsomeguy: There are multiple possibilities to define Semigroup over Ints so there is Sum and Product to capture these. |
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| 23:07:55 | <koz_> | In many cases you can define Semigroup in several ways, all of which abide by its law. |
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| 23:08:07 | <koz_> | Associative operations in general tend not to be unique for most interesting types. |
| 23:08:11 | <koz_> | (even Bool has like, four) |
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| 23:15:53 | <edwardk> | if you just want associativity there should be a lot more, it's when you want associativity and a unit, no? |
| 23:17:24 | <koz_> | edwardk: OK yeah, it's more than four. |
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| 23:17:40 | <ephemient> | that would be Monoid? |
| 23:18:00 | <edwardk> | yeah |
| 23:18:43 | <edwardk> | @let op f x y = testBit f (fromEnum x*2 + fromEnum x) |
| 23:18:45 | <lambdabot> | Defined. |
| 23:18:58 | <edwardk> | @let assoc (op -> f) = and [f x (f y z) == f (f x y) z|x<-b,y<-b,z<-b] where b = [False,True] |
| 23:18:59 | <lambdabot> | .L.hs:163:8: error: |
| 23:18:59 | <lambdabot> | Ambiguous occurrence ‘op’ |
| 23:18:59 | <lambdabot> | It could refer to |
| 23:19:17 | <edwardk> | @let oper f x y = testBit f (fromEnum x*2 + fromEnum x) |
| 23:19:18 | <lambdabot> | Defined. |
| 23:19:22 | <edwardk> | @let assoc (oper -> f) = and [f x (f y z) == f (f x y) z|x<-b,y<-b,z<-b] where b = [False,True] |
| 23:19:23 | <lambdabot> | Defined. |
| 23:19:33 | <edwardk> | > length $ filter assoc [0..15] |
| 23:19:35 | <lambdabot> | 12 |
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| 23:59:30 | <koz_> | Yep, that looks about right. |
| 23:59:55 | <polyphem> | edwardk: what about the y in oper ?? |
All times are in UTC on 2021-02-07.