Logs on 2021-06-06 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 09:00:46 | <safinaskar> | it is possible to have multiple type contructors with same name? say, "data X = A | B; data Y = A | C". i want to refer to such constructors similary to this: X.A, Y.A |
| 09:01:28 | × | img quits (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
| 09:01:35 | <Hecate> | I think so |
| 09:01:48 | <safinaskar> | i meant data constructors, of course |
| 09:02:04 | <tomsmeding> | safinaskar: I believe only if you put them in different modules and import those modules qualified |
| 09:02:10 | <Hecate> | yep ^ |
| 09:03:03 | → | img joins (~img@user/img) |
| 09:03:07 | <safinaskar> | tomsmeding: and what if they are defined in same module? |
| 09:03:22 | <safinaskar> | i want something similar to "enum class" in modern c++ |
| 09:03:32 | <tomsmeding> | not sure if haskell has that |
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| 09:04:27 | <arjun> | Hi Hecate |
| 09:04:55 | <Hecate> | hey arjun, what's up? |
| 09:05:17 | <arjun> | nm, how ya doin |
| 09:05:26 | <Hecate> | fairly good, thank you |
| 09:05:29 | <Hecate> | it's sunny out here |
| 09:06:49 | <arjun> | lazy sunday afternoons are the Best |
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| 09:25:59 | ← | jakalx parts (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) () |
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| 09:27:32 | <juri_> | wheee... |
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| 09:28:33 | <juri_> | actually made an Org for haskell-based manufacturing tools on github. https://github.com/Haskell-Things . almost looks professional. :) |
| 09:29:00 | <Hecate> | juri_: woop woop |
| 09:29:25 | <Rembane_> | juri_: 100% pro! |
| 09:30:28 | <juri_> | One of these days, i'll get the slicer working correctly. this is the year, i feel it. :P |
| 09:31:46 | <Rembane_> | The year of slicer on the desktop? :) |
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| 09:32:11 | <juri_> | oh god no. no-one has desktop CPUs that are reasonable for slicing. :P |
| 09:33:18 | <Rembane_> | :D |
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| 09:35:32 | <arjun> | juri_: no one has desktop CPU's. period. T_T |
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| 09:36:23 | <arjun> | i've been looking into getting pc parts. and between the lockdowns, pandemic, scalping and supply shortage |
| 09:36:42 | <arjun> | its just bad rn : / |
| 09:36:58 | <Rembane_> | Oh yes. |
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| 10:32:41 | <maerwald> | arjun: I needed a very specific crimp tool for my keyboard project... and due to all the mess, the price went up to 1600$ for that tool |
| 10:32:51 | <maerwald> | it's maybe worth 20 bucks |
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| 10:34:07 | <maerwald> | put your electronics projects on hold for a while |
| 10:34:11 | <arjun> | maerwald: you could get probably 5 high-end keyboards for that lol? |
| 10:34:29 | <maerwald> | yeah... or just us fkn pliers for crimping lol |
| 10:34:40 | <arjun> | HANDS |
| 10:34:43 | <arjun> | TEETH |
| 10:34:49 | <arjun> | YEAEAAAARH+GGGHH |
| 10:35:54 | <maerwald> | it also helped me discover that precicion tweezers can indeed pierce through your finger nails |
| 10:36:10 | <maerwald> | wouldn't have found out otherwise |
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| 12:12:53 | <arjun> | writeFile "path/lol.txt" "hi lol" |
| 12:13:12 | <arjun> | file doesn't exist. how do i tell it to make the file and write if it doesn't exist |
| 12:13:28 | <arjun> | is there a mode setting or a seprate function for this ? |
| 12:13:28 | <maerwald> | arjun: you mean `path` doesn't exist? |
| 12:13:55 | <maerwald> | writeFile already creates the file if non-existent |
| 12:14:01 | <maerwald> | this is likely an issue with directory |
| 12:14:19 | <arjun> | Exception: /home/arjun/Documents/projects/AssGen/output/lol.html: openFile: does not exist (No such file or directory) |
| 12:14:37 | <arjun> | right. i haven't made the `output` dir |
| 12:14:52 | <maerwald> | @hoogle createDirectoryIfMissing |
| 12:14:52 | <lambdabot> | System.Directory createDirectoryIfMissing :: Bool -> FilePath -> IO () |
| 12:14:52 | <lambdabot> | UnliftIO.Directory createDirectoryIfMissing :: MonadIO m => Bool -> FilePath -> m () |
| 12:14:52 | <lambdabot> | System.Path.Directory createDirectoryIfMissing :: AbsRel ar => Bool -> DirPath ar -> IO () |
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| 12:15:32 | <arjun> | gotcha' thanks maerwald: |
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| 12:26:55 | pja | pats hoogle |
| 12:28:16 | <ixlun> | Hi all. I've got a quick question. Suppose I have [IO Int]. I can use `sequence` to run all those actions and get a nice result. However, if I want to `intersperse (threadDelay n)`, I can't since `()` won't match `Int`. Is there a way around this? |
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| 12:30:59 | <tomsmeding> | @botsnack |
| 12:30:59 | <lambdabot> | :) |
| 12:31:00 | <maerwald> | `intersperse (threadDelay n >> pure 0)` |
| 12:31:52 | <ixlun> | maerwald: Ah, sneaky! |
| 12:32:04 | <maerwald> | or turn it into Maybe/Nothing |
| 12:32:08 | <tomsmeding> | \l -> case l of [] -> [] ; x:xs -> x : map (threadDelay n >>) xs |
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| 12:34:58 | <ixlun> | got it. Thanks for the info maerwald and tomsmeding ! |
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| 13:07:41 | <Guest22> | hi guys, i'm new to functional programming. i have a question about it not specific to Haskell (I'm using JavaScript), is that ok? |
| 13:11:26 | <pja> | Hi level questions might get an answer, for anything specific to JS you’re probably better off asking in a JS specific channel. |
| 13:12:17 | <Guest22> | thanks, that's what i'm going for basically so i know which terms to google |
| 13:12:27 | <Guest22> | and work out how they apply to JS |
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| 13:15:03 | <Guest22> | sorry i'm giving myself a headache trying to express a pretty simple problem by thinking about it functionally |
| 13:15:17 | <Guest22> | i have a grid which is an array of arrays |
| 13:15:30 | <Guest22> | i want to remove the top element of the column and add one at the bottom |
| 13:17:25 | <Guest22> | so like one way would be grid.map(column.drop(1)).map(column.add(thing)) |
| 13:17:47 | <Guest22> | but instead of calling map repeatedly, is there a way through like partial application or something to call it once? |
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| 13:21:10 | <Guest22> | my other idea was to make a function that does both operations and pass that into map (think that's called function composition) |
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| 13:28:24 | <lyxia> | ^ This is the way. |
| 13:28:40 | <lyxia> | map f . map g = map (f . g) |
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| 13:30:23 | <Guest22> | ok i think i get you |
| 13:30:26 | <Guest22> | thanks very much |
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| 13:30:59 | <Guest22> | that makes it easier if i don't have to look up how currying works or anything! |
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| 13:39:52 | <pja> | Javascript functional libraries usually do function composition of this form with a function called pipe() if my quick googling is to be believed. |
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| 14:06:18 | <maerwald> | > let pipe = foldr (.) id in pipe [reverse, reverse] $ "yes" |
| 14:06:19 | <lambdabot> | "yes" |
| 14:06:36 | <maerwald> | > let pipe = foldr (.) id in pipe [reverse, reverse, reverse] $ "yes" |
| 14:06:37 | <lambdabot> | "sey" |
| 14:06:58 | <maerwald> | we have it too, lol |
| 14:08:22 | <boxscape> | % ala Endo foldMap [reverse, reverse, reverse] "foo" |
| 14:08:22 | <yahb> | boxscape: "oof" |
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| 15:17:48 | <boxscape> | hm I just realized I've never seen ala used with anything other than foldMap |
| 15:17:53 | <boxscape> | all the examples in haddock also use foldMap |
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| 15:49:04 | <boxscape> | the libraries implementing it all say it's form Conor McBride's work on Epigram, but without an actual reference where I could read about this particular aspect |
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| 15:57:29 | <boxscape> | % ala Product traverse [1..5] |
| 15:57:29 | <yahb> | boxscape: [1,2,3,4,5] |
| 15:57:30 | <boxscape> | amazing |
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| 16:01:20 | <boxscape> | new id function for obfuscation? |
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| 16:06:18 | <boxscape> | % let id' :: a -> a; id' = fromMaybe (fix . const $ fix id) . listToMaybe . ala Product traverse . pure |
| 16:06:18 | <yahb> | boxscape: |
| 16:07:12 | <tomsmeding> | % id' 42 |
| 16:07:12 | <yahb> | tomsmeding: 42 |
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| 16:16:43 | <boxscape> | okay, I have found Conor using it for something that's not foldMap: `ala Cont traverse` https://www.mail-archive.com/haskell-cafe@haskell.org/msg37213.html |
| 16:17:17 | <tomsmeding> | why does hlint suggest turning sortBy into sortOn when the two have very different performance semantics |
| 16:17:30 | <tomsmeding> | s/semantics/characteristics/ |
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| 16:18:25 | <boxscape> | isn't sortOn faster? Doesn't hlint suggest faster variants in a few places? |
| 16:18:43 | <boxscape> | (like turning concat . map f into concatMap f) |
| 16:19:35 | <tomsmeding> | sortOn first computes and caches a list containing (map f l), then sorts by looking up the keys in that cached list |
| 16:19:52 | <tomsmeding> | so it calls f only O(n) times, whereas sortBy calls it O(n log n) times |
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| 16:20:02 | <tomsmeding> | sortBy is faster if f is cheap, like a simple projection |
| 16:20:11 | <boxscape> | ah |
| 16:20:27 | <tomsmeding> | which is nigh always the case for me :p |
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| 16:20:33 | <boxscape> | right, makes sense |
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| 16:29:47 | <albet70> | how to make a very simple language and use parsec to parse it? |
| 16:30:08 | <Hanicef> | albet70: well, do you have a design for a simple language? |
| 16:30:31 | <albet70> | scheme? |
| 16:30:43 | <Hanicef> | i dont think you need parsec for that :) |
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| 16:31:13 | <Hanicef> | afaik parsec is for more complex parsing, but im no expert |
| 16:31:28 | <albet70> | is there an article to design a simple language? |
| 16:31:29 | <boxscape> | albet70 there's a free book about using Haskell to write a Scheme interpreter, which does happen to use Parsec https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Write_Yourself_a_Scheme_in_48_Hours |
| 16:31:56 | <boxscape> | ...I guess you could also call it a series of blog posts |
| 16:32:33 | anderson_ | is now known as anderson |
| 16:32:38 | <Hanicef> | boxscape: +1, didnt know that existed |
| 16:32:41 | <albet70> | boxscape, any others like this? |
| 16:32:55 | <boxscape> | quite possibly, but nothing that I'm aware of |
| 16:33:04 | <albet70> | I saw a few chapters of it |
| 16:33:16 | <albet70> | until that environment |
| 16:33:25 | <albet70> | evaluation |
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| 17:46:30 | <sclv> | i recommend parsec for even simple parsers -- anything more complicated than can be done with just a few string functions at least |
| 17:47:34 | <glguy> | I'd recommend parsec mostly for the simple parsers |
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| 17:47:57 | <glguy> | If you're doing something big it's better to make a real lexer/parser with something like alex/happy |
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| 19:05:30 | <_73> | Why when I do both the `k` and `v` need to have Ord instances when using Data.Set.insert to insert into a `Set (k,v)`? I would have thought only the `k` needed an Ord instance. http://dpaste.com/B7HU5B4VP |
| 19:06:03 | <geekosaur> | you're confusing Set with Map, it sounds like |
| 19:06:11 | <geekosaur> | you have a single key which is a pair |
| 19:07:31 | <_73> | so the problem is that I need an Ord instance for the entire `(k,v)`? |
| 19:07:47 | <_73> | Still then I would think that only requires on Ord instance for the k |
| 19:07:50 | <geekosaur> | your "v" is not a v. (k,v) is the entire key |
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| 19:08:00 | <geekosaur> | you want a Data.Map |
| 19:08:43 | <_73> | I do want a Set. |
| 19:08:54 | <boxscape> | _73 with Set (k, v), how would it handle two elements (0, 1) and (0, 2) if it doesn't have a way to compare 1 and 2? |
| 19:11:18 | <_73> | So this is specific to Sets? |
| 19:12:15 | <geekosaur> | ? a Set is a collection of unique keys. a Map is a mapping from unique keys to values. it sounds like you want the latter |
| 19:12:17 | <boxscape> | well, kind of depends on what you mean by "this". Sets require that the type of their elements have an Ord instance. For a pair (k, v) to have an Ord instance (the type of the elements of your Set), both k and v must have an Ord instance |
| 19:12:27 | <boxscape> | % data A = A |
| 19:12:27 | <yahb> | boxscape: |
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| 19:12:33 | <boxscape> | % (0, A) < (5, A) |
| 19:12:33 | <yahb> | boxscape: ; <interactive>:72:8: error:; * No instance for (Ord A) arising from a use of `<'; * In the expression: (0, A) < (5, A); In an equation for `it': it = (0, A) < (5, A) |
| 19:12:43 | <boxscape> | you can't compare these because there's no Ord instance for A |
| 19:13:31 | <shachaf> | What makes you say you want a Set? |
| 19:14:04 | <_73> | ohh now I see what is going on. My GHCi example only worked because Int has an Ord instance |
| 19:14:11 | <boxscape> | right :) |
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| 19:14:25 | <_73> | ok now I understand thanks |
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| 19:25:41 | <Hecate> | dcoutts: heya, would you happen to have a link to your 2014 paper "Binary serialisation: better, stronger, faster"? |
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| 20:06:06 | <tomsmeding> | Is it true that you cannot emulate the full power of GADTs using pattern synonyms, in particular existentials? |
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| 20:06:40 | <tomsmeding> | I'm trying to convert a GADT to a more efficient representation, providing pattern synonyms to keep existing code working: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/AnurdoDe |
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| 20:07:33 | <safinaskar> | look at this very interesting piece of code: https://github.com/mpickering/ghc-proposals/blob/splice-imports/proposals/0000-splice-imports.rst#id4 |
| 20:07:49 | <safinaskar> | please, point to some article explaining how such code works |
| 20:07:59 | <safinaskar> | i. e. when we see so nested template haskell |
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| 20:16:01 | <c_wraith> | safinaskar: you don't often see such a thing, but it's just evaluated recursively. Need to do a TH splice when running TH code? Just recursively enter the splicing code |
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| 20:26:51 | <safinaskar> | c_wraith: thanks |
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| 20:28:37 | <tomsmeding> | by the way regarding my question above, I'd be perfectly fine with some unsafeCoerce to achieve this, but I'm afraid it's not possible at all |
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| 20:33:44 | <shachaf> | tomsmeding: Pattern synonyms are a bit after my time, so I'm probably missing something, but what's the double => in those pattern synonyms for? |
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| 20:35:14 | <shachaf> | It seems to compile and behave similarly to the GADT without the () =>. |
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| 20:41:18 | <geekosaur> | pattern synonyms can both require and provide contexts, hence the double => |
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| 20:44:31 | <shachaf> | Aha. OK. |
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| 20:49:27 | <tomsmeding> | shachaf: indeed, the point was that the pattern synonym requires no constraints but provides the equality constraint upon a successful match |
| 20:50:26 | <boxscape> | hm that seems like terribly confusing syntax |
| 20:50:27 | <tomsmeding> | if I remove the `() =>` and hence make the equality constraint a required constraint, I can't write 'isZero :: Idx env t -> Bool ; isZero ZeroIdx = True' because the match on ZeroIdx then requires that the 'env' type parameter of isZero equates to a pair, which it doesn't |
| 20:50:31 | <boxscape> | though I don't have a better suggestion |
| 20:50:36 | <tomsmeding> | boxscape: don't get me started on that :p |
| 20:50:41 | <boxscape> | okay :D |
| 20:51:20 | <tomsmeding> | but I agree |
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| 20:58:30 | <shachaf> | tomsmeding: Right, makes sense. |
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| 21:22:01 | <boxscape> | tomsmeding I imagine this probably wouldn't work for some reason? https://paste.tomsmeding.com/k4XVU1SF |
| 21:23:02 | <tomsmeding> | boxscape: same thing where that isZero formulation I wrote a few messages back doesn't typecheck |
| 21:23:23 | <boxscape> | ah, I see |
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| 21:25:48 | tomsmeding | is off to bed, I'll check the logs tomorrow :) |
| 21:25:55 | <boxscape> | good night |
| 21:26:05 | <tomsmeding> | thanks! |
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| 22:04:44 | <boxscape> | out of curiosity does any know off the top of their head whether modeling a free monad as `newtype FreeMonad f x = FreeMonad {runMonad :: ∀ m . Monad m => (f ~> m) -> m x}` or as `data FreeMonad' f a = Pure a | Free (f (FreeMonad' f a))` is faster? |
| 22:04:50 | <boxscape> | where `type f ~> g = ∀ α . f α -> g α` |
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| 22:05:09 | <boxscape> | i.e. faster in terms of performance |
| 22:05:15 | <c_wraith> | both are faster |
| 22:05:20 | <boxscape> | well that's nice |
| 22:05:24 | <c_wraith> | The question is "at what?" |
| 22:05:27 | <boxscape> | ah |
| 22:06:05 | <c_wraith> | the function representation is faster when you just want to build something and then interpret it in a single shot |
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| 22:06:29 | <c_wraith> | The data representation is faster when you want to introspect the constructed structure, tearing it down piece by piece |
| 22:06:42 | <boxscape> | I see |
| 22:06:46 | <boxscape> | thanks |
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| 22:07:55 | <monochrom> | The "free" package has a function that lets you start with the data version and still gain some efficiency when interpreting. |
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| 22:09:04 | <boxscape> | okay |
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| 23:01:57 | <monochrom> | \∩/ ghcup knows 8.10.5 |
| 23:04:47 | <geekosaur> | hls doesn't, though. and I'm not sure I want to rebuild the universe just yet |
| 23:05:06 | <monochrom> | I didn't build anything with 8.10.4 :) |
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| 23:15:09 | <janus> | does someone know of a good introduction to the continuation monad? |
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| 23:18:23 | <boxscape> | janus I thought this was alright https://en.m.wikibooks.org/wiki/Haskell/Continuation_passing_style |
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| 23:19:52 | <Flux> | I installed a package via "stack build <pkg>" and am trying to import the package but it's not working, any tips on how I might debug this? |
| 23:20:20 | <Flux> | By not working, I mean it can't find the module when i try to import it |
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| 23:27:01 | <janus> | Flux: you need to make sure that the build environment uses the same stack-lts that you built it with |
| 23:27:15 | <Flux> | can you explain what that means |
| 23:27:40 | <janus> | Flux: when you write "stack build <pkg>" in some arbitrary folder, stack will choose some arbitrary compiler version to install the package for |
| 23:27:53 | <janus> | but most likely you are trying to use it in some project, right? |
| 23:27:58 | <Flux> | yeah |
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| 23:28:17 | <janus> | so if that is the case, it makes more sense to add the dependency to your project configuration so that you can put it in version control and such |
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| 23:28:33 | <Flux> | hmm like when i do "stack build" and "stack run" things are ok |
| 23:28:37 | <Flux> | but i'm trying to mess around in ghci |
| 23:28:40 | <Flux> | and it's not importing correctly |
| 23:28:50 | <geekosaur> | stack ghci, or just plain ghci? |
| 23:28:58 | <janus> | if you don't have a project, and you just want a repl with the package, you can write 'stack repl <pkg>' |
| 23:29:00 | <Flux> | oh i was using plain ghci |
| 23:29:04 | <geekosaur> | plain ghci will not see things installed by stack |
| 23:29:22 | <Flux> | gotcha, didn't know that |
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| 23:29:48 | <janus> | but better just write a package.yaml, stick it in there, and then you can have version control |
| 23:30:03 | <janus> | and you can specify the ghc flags and all that jazz |
| 23:31:37 | <Flux> | what is stack ghci actually doing |
| 23:31:53 | <Flux> | it's taking an awfully long time |
| 23:32:09 | <monochrom> | janus: My http://www.vex.net/~trebla/haskell/cont.xhtml is a good introduction to the Cont monad. |
| 23:32:19 | <janus> | Flux: it will look for a project configuration file, and if it doesn't find one, it will just choose some compiler and lts and download the packages for that |
| 23:32:42 | <janus> | Flux: so if you have a desired lts or compiler you want to use, better specify it... and if you specify it, why not specify it in a file ;) |
| 23:33:05 | <janus> | Flux: it is probably taking a long time because it needs to get its own ghc which is separate from the ghci you invoke from the command line |
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| 23:33:29 | <janus> | Flux: and if the package you specify has a lot of dependencies, all of those will need to get built for that compiler |
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| 23:39:21 | <Flux> | i see, i think there is a stack.yaml file |
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| 23:40:12 | <Flux> | but somehow it cannot satisfy package |
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| 23:46:06 | <janus> | if you can do "stack build <pkg>" in that directory, you should also be able to do "stack repl <pkg>" |
| 23:46:35 | <janus> | if you can do "stack build <pkg>" in another directory, but not that one, it is probably because that specific lts/ghc version is not compatible with the package |
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| 23:46:52 | <janus> | if you tell us the name maybe it is easier to debug, and paste the error in the pastebin in topic |
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| 23:48:27 | <Flux> | sure, i am trying to build hasktorch https://github.com/hasktorch/hasktorch |
| 23:49:07 | <Flux> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/3l5bgA93 |
| 23:49:08 | <Flux> | here is the error i am seeing |
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| 23:52:28 | <janus> | Flux: which command is that the output of? |
| 23:52:32 | <Flux> | stack ghci |
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| 23:53:00 | <Flux> | eveyrthing else works (like stack build hasktorch, etc) |
| 23:53:09 | <janus> | Flux: ok i think that warning says that it wants you to specify package since it doesn't support multiple packages for the ghci |
| 23:53:34 | <janus> | Flux: so maybe try "stack repl examples" or "stack repl hasktorch" from that same folder? |
| 23:53:55 | <Flux> | ok that does not work either |
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| 23:54:34 | <Flux> | stack repl hasktorch worked but not examples |
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