Logs on 2023-02-01 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 00:36:23 | <EvanR> | is a recession language like a d&d alignment language, once you're no longer in a recession do you inexplicably forget how to speak it? |
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| 00:43:09 | <monochrom> | Students inexplicably forget what they learned after exams all the time. >:) |
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| 00:49:53 | <c_wraith> | monochrom: inexplicably? I forgot everything from my operating systems course 3 minutes after finishing the final. Because I only learned it cramming all night the night before. |
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| 00:52:19 | <monochrom> | Heh of course tongue-in-cheek and/or sarcastic and/or hyperbol in "inexplicably" :) |
| 00:53:02 | <c_wraith> | it was kind of funny walking out of the final, relaxing, and just feeling my brain empty |
| 00:53:35 | <hpc> | like a reverse keanu reeves :D |
| 00:54:06 | <hpc> | i remember all the stuff from those classes, but i don't remember learning it |
| 00:54:18 | <hpc> | and i distinctly remember having not learned it then |
| 00:54:40 | <hpc> | i don't know where the knowledge came from |
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| 04:26:36 | <cole-k> | simple question I know, but where may I find functions for converting number bases? My search engine skills are only bringing up GHC.Base |
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| 04:30:37 | <maerwald[m]> | monochrom: yes, exams are not designed for students to learn and remember stuff. They are designed to torture them (test their stress tolerance) |
| 04:30:58 | <maerwald[m]> | Unsurprisingly, this concept is largely derived from military practices |
| 04:31:22 | <maerwald[m]> | And somewhat goes against recent brain/learning science |
| 04:31:49 | <maerwald[m]> | But educational institutions are largely backwards, so can't expect them to catch up |
| 04:36:45 | <monochrom> | The "Numeric" module has showIntBase etc. |
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| 04:40:27 | <cole-k> | monochrom: thanks! |
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| 07:50:40 | <Unhammer> | Does anyone have a trick for showing documentation inside ghci in the emacs haskell-mode repl? |
| 07:50:57 | <Unhammer> | (I feel like eglot should be able to do it) |
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| 08:03:29 | <[exa]> | Unhammer: tbh I never saw the haskell docs directly in the ghci; they're generally not "visible" to the language except if you run haddock and somehow put them back |
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| 08:15:57 | <[Leary]> | % :doc Maybe |
| 08:15:57 | <yahb2> | The 'Maybe' type encapsulates an optional value. A value of type ; @'Maybe' a@ either contains a value of type @a@ (represented as @'Just' a@), ; or it is empty (represented as 'Nothing'). Usin... |
| 08:16:19 | <[Leary]> | I think that's recent. I haven't used it much myself. |
| 08:16:31 | <[Leary]> | Unhammer, [exa] ^ |
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| 08:19:37 | <[exa]> | oh wow, TIL |
| 08:20:24 | <tomsmeding> | doesn't work on a module you loaded directly into ghci, though |
| 08:20:30 | <tomsmeding> | have to :set +d first, or what was it |
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| 08:22:48 | <tomsmeding> | ah no, :set -haddock |
| 08:23:10 | <tomsmeding> | and after that you have to :reload to make it work but its dependency analysis doesn't realise that everything needs to be reloaded now :p |
| 08:23:21 | <tomsmeding> | so more reliable is 'cabal repl --repl-flags=-haddock' |
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| 08:53:20 | <Unhammer> | omg |
| 08:53:22 | <Unhammer> | :doc is great |
| 08:53:41 | <Unhammer> | how did I not know about that =D |
| 08:54:04 | <[exa]> | yeah like, when was that added? |
| 08:54:18 | <Unhammer> | I'm on 8.10.7 |
| 08:55:17 | <Unhammer> | it even tells me (when I try on my own fn's) that I have to :set -haddock and :load, very helpful |
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| 08:59:46 | <kuribas> | Unhammer: long time ago |
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| 11:21:32 | <freeside> | so, I'm working on a family of little embedded DSLs, starting with good old MathLang and branching out to BoolPropLang and BoolPredLang. In each language I naturally want to be able to eval() expressions, which is fine. But I also want the evaluator to "show your work" -- to verbosely output a tree of expressions that reduce rootward to the overall answer. |
| 11:22:18 | <freeside> | Is there a generally accepted pattern for this? I am thinking about having a typeclass that i can instantiate each of my languages into, which will perform both eval() and explain() |
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| 12:06:49 | <chreekat> | freeside: free monads? |
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| 12:14:55 | <jackdk> | instead of evaluating all the way to a normal form, write small step evaluation rules for your expr |
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| 12:16:27 | <jackdk> | each step rule is a function Expr -> Maybe Expr that returns Just if it applies, and it should be the case that exactly one applies |
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| 12:17:31 | <jackdk> | recursing into an expression for a rule like (foo && bar) -> (foo' && bar) if foo not a value and foo -> foo' will need you to pass the step function into itself in a tie-the-knot style |
| 12:17:53 | <jackdk> | I think there's a bit about that in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZp9IFgFFts |
| 12:18:17 | <jackdk> | but then your trace is an unfold on your initial expression: apply your small step until it does nothing |
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| 12:36:55 | <christiansen[m]> | freeside: I'd do this by converting the evaluator to something like a CEK machine, and then saving machine states |
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| 12:47:45 | ncf | sighs |
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| 13:09:05 | <Mahi> | Hello! I am having trouble with Maybe types: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/QdANTCQl |
| 13:09:05 | <Mahi> | It complains that I don't have Eq for CountryCode, but I'm trying to compare Maybe to Nothing instead of comparing the country code? |
| 13:10:26 | <Mahi> | I can easily fix it by adding "deriving (Eq)", but I'm wondering why it needs that for Maybe? |
| 13:10:57 | <__monty__> | Mahi: Consider the case where both Maybes are Justs. |
| 13:11:04 | <lortabac> | Mahi: you can use 'isNothing' from Data.Maybe |
| 13:11:29 | <Mahi> | Ah, right, then it compares the internal values of the Justs. Well that explains already, thank you! |
| 13:11:32 | <__monty__> | Equality comparison wouldn't be able to give a proper answer unless the values are also comparable. |
| 13:11:32 | <lortabac> | it doesn't require Eq because it only pattern matches on the constructors |
| 13:11:41 | <Mahi> | lortabac thank you, did not know such thing exists |
| 13:11:51 | <Mahi> | Exactly what I need! |
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| 13:14:16 | <lortabac> | Mahi: may I suggest you to define your own 'displayPhoneNumber' function instead of using Show? |
| 13:14:41 | <Mahi> | These are for university exercises and the teacher requires me to use Show so I don't believe that to be possible :D |
| 13:14:47 | <lortabac> | oh ok :) |
| 13:15:14 | <Mahi> | Also I ran into issues, we're not allowed to use readMaybe ;__; I hate courses where you can't use common tools of the language, as if I would run into this issue in the real world... |
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| 13:24:07 | <Mahi> | Now my `show Phone`prints out things like `MakePhoneNo 123456 (Just Other)`instead of desired `123456 (Other)` https://paste.tomsmeding.com/rVDmcmSU |
| 13:24:25 | <Mahi> | Help appreciated! |
| 13:25:44 | <Mahi> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/hOgNLaSF Here's the entire code, my read functions are at the bottom, they could be the cause as well |
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| 13:28:04 | <AndreasK> | Mahi: You call show on the `Maybe` value in the Just case, not on the value wrapped by the just |
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| 13:28:41 | <AndreasK> | The MakePhoneNo comes from the derived Show instance, if you want to avoid that you have to write the instance yourself. |
| 13:30:08 | <Mahi> | Ah, thank you. I am lost with Maybe's, the derived Show makes sense though :) |
| 13:30:34 | <AndreasK> | what happens is that you call show (Just x) which produces "Just <x>" |
| 13:30:52 | <ncf> | freeside: you received three answers while you were away https://f.monade.li/Rhr8Ud |
| 13:31:18 | <ncf> | chreekat, jackdk, christiansen[m]: you need to configure your irc client to tell you when people leave |
| 13:31:23 | <Mahi> | I'm completely lost on how to extract the "x" from "Just x":D We're not allowed to use the "import" anywhere so I can't use fromJust |
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| 13:32:10 | <AndreasK> | `maybe` is in the prelude you can use that probably |
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| 13:33:54 | <Mahi> | That appears to have worked, thank you very much AndreasK |
| 13:34:25 | <Mahi> | Tried to use `maybe` yesterday and couldn't get anything done, now I took one glance at it after a good night's sleep and it was obvious how to use it :D |
| 13:34:52 | <AndreasK> | That's often the way it goes :D |
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| 13:35:52 | <chreekat> | sigh. I should just not bother answering questions in #haskell, they've already left 99% of the time anyway |
| 13:36:11 | <chreekat> | Though I agree it's annoying that Element will still tab-complete somebody's name after they've left |
| 13:36:17 | <AndreasK> | chreekat: I just make sure to try to autocomplete their name if that fails their gone :D |
| 13:36:25 | <AndreasK> | Ah I see |
| 13:44:47 | <ncf> | element is annoying in its own right, but using it to interface with IRC is just pure masochism |
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| 13:48:24 | <maerwald> | well, it's better than all IRC android clients |
| 13:48:30 | <maerwald> | that's the only reason I use it |
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| 13:55:09 | <geekosaur> | ^ |
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| 13:59:28 | <chreekat> | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ IRC has always been masochism |
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| 14:00:03 | <christiansen[m]> | yeah, I'm in element too |
| 14:01:58 | <ncf> | weechat-android is alright (but it's only a relay client) |
| 14:03:27 | <christiansen[m]> | Maybe I should just go back to running a bouncer on linode :) |
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| 14:05:47 | <sm> | element FTW! But I do look forward to when the irc bridge can show presence accurately |
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| 14:59:16 | <jean-paul[m]> | Are there options other than hpc for coverage measurement? |
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| 15:11:15 | <Guillaum[m]> | jean-paul.: what do you mean about "other options". You can convert the hpc result files (mix/tix) to something else, such as lcov. There are also https://cs-syd.eu/posts/2022-12-16-announcing-dekking which was recently announced. |
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| 15:18:10 | <jean-paul[m]> | I guess Dekking is exactly the kind of thing I was wondering about as far as "other options" |
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| 15:22:27 | <Guillaum[m]> | jean-paul.: read the limitations of dekking, they can be really "limiting" for your use case, or totally acceptable ;) Have fun doing coverage. |
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| 17:42:28 | <Mahi> | Hi, why isn't my map insert working? https://paste.tomsmeding.com/DCxRIOzd |
| 17:42:44 | <Mahi> | Here's the error I'm getting, I kind of understand what it means but I don't see how it fits my code: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/H9HOVTzd |
| 17:43:08 | <Mahi> | Where exactly am I comparing `[Phone]` with a `Phone` is my question I guess |
| 17:43:48 | <Mahi> | the `(readPhone pt cc pn)` is provided by teaches and produces a `Phone` |
| 17:43:50 | <geekosaur> | You can't append a single item to a list tjay wau |
| 17:43:54 | <geekosaur> | *that way |
| 17:44:03 | <geekosaur> | :t (:) |
| 17:44:04 | <lambdabot> | a -> [a] -> [a] |
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| 17:44:27 | <Mahi> | Ohhhh so I need to add it to the front |
| 17:44:38 | <geekosaur> | either prepend it or use `++ [phone]` |
| 17:44:47 | <Mahi> | Ahh thank you very much! |
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| 18:17:16 | <freeside> | ncf: thank you, reviewing |
| 18:17:37 | <freeside> | apologies for my bouncy bouncy, i think i might need to switch to a more stable client |
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| 18:32:03 | <freeside> | chreekat, jackdk: thank you for your answers |
| 18:32:15 | <freeside> | i am now watching the David Laing -- Little Languages talk |
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| 19:07:12 | <eldritchcookie[4> | i considering doing a library similar to HaTeX for ConTeXt and i would like for it to be impossible to with normal use generate invalid ConTeXt markup, however it is common and expected to define your own commands in ConTeXt how can i prevent the use of a undefined command but allow defined ones? |
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| 19:51:15 | <proportions> | Why im banned here on nickname but not on account |
| 19:51:20 | <proportions> | This is not logical at all |
| 19:51:44 | <proportions> | It *forces* banned person to troll you under another nickname |
| 19:52:34 | <c_wraith> | or it's just a warning. |
| 19:52:43 | <c_wraith> | perhaps you aren't required to troll at all |
| 19:53:37 | <proportions> | At the moment I have no such plans but that may change |
| 19:53:48 | proportions | is now known as tsns |
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| 19:55:10 | <jean-paul[m]> | I renamed my project's .cabal file and now cabal can't find it ... what else do I have to do to be able to rename it? |
| 19:55:24 | <jean-paul[m]> | (it still ends with .cabal, the renaming was like foo.cabal to bar.cabal) |
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| 19:57:59 | <geekosaur> | I'm surprised, unless you pointed to it by name in `cabal.project` |
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| 19:58:52 | <geekosaur> | (usually one points to the directory containing it instead) |
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| 20:01:12 | <jean-paul[m]> | https://gist.github.com/exarkun/b38944443d9ea6d1a76d8f522a16696d |
| 20:02:26 | <geekosaur> | if you have a `cabal.project` then you need a `src:` line in it indicating the (directories containing) cabal packages to build |
| 20:03:33 | <geekosaur> | sorry, `packages:` |
| 20:03:41 | <geekosaur> | https://github.com/geekosaur/xmonad.hs/blob/skkukuk/cabal.project |
| 20:04:49 | <jean-paul[m]> | Huh. I definitely successfully ran cabal build after adding that cabal.project file (but maybe only once or twice). Maybe something was cached and I wiped out the cache while I was renaming everything? |
| 20:04:59 | <jean-paul[m]> | Indeed, adding packages: ./ fixes it |
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| 20:07:30 | <geekosaur> | possibly `cabal build` works unless it has to do a reconfigure, yeh. you'd have to ask someone better versed in cabal internals about that |
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| 20:17:10 | <jean-paul[m]> | Thanks! |
| 20:18:14 | <jean-paul[m]> | How about an emacs question! With lsp-haskell I get suggestions to the right of real text in a haskell-mode buffer (terminal mode emacs). Suggestions like "Set module name to Tahoe.CHK.Types". I could press a bunch of buttons my keyboard like a schlub to do that, but surely there's some keystroke for "yea, sure, do it for me"? |
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| 20:21:15 | <geekosaur> | I don't use lsp-haskell so wouldn't know, sorry |
| 20:27:13 | <jean-paul[m]> | no worries, thanks for reading, and for the cabal help |
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| 20:34:10 | <ddellacosta> | jean-paul[m]: if you find out, please let me know --another terminal mode emacs user |
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| 20:35:08 | <jean-paul[m]> | #emacs helped me to lsp-avy-lens, which is apparently a way to click on things in the terminal. it seems to work in the one very simple case I've tried so far. |
| 20:35:20 | <ddellacosta> | oh cool, will take a look, thank you! |
| 20:36:03 | <ddellacosta> | I have to admit I largely avoid #emacs |
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| 20:36:56 | <jean-paul[m]> | I get it. There are some places on the internet you just don't want to be. |
| 20:37:01 | <geekosaur> | I found it pretty toxic the few times I went there |
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| 20:38:33 | <ddellacosta> | yep :-( |
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| 20:59:28 | <sm> | I lurk there.. not watching it 24/7 but seems pretty good humoured most of the time |
| 20:59:33 | <sm> | extremely off topic though.. |
| 21:00:13 | <sm> | there's also #emacs:matrix.org |
| 21:00:23 | <geekosaur> | huh. maybe it's improved since freenode days |
| 21:00:30 | sm | gives #emacs a hug |
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| 21:00:56 | <sm> | it's definitely got the funniest bot. I don't know what the heck is going on with it most of the time :) |
| 21:01:39 | <sm> | lambdabot could learn a thing or two |
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| 21:20:10 | tomsmeding | is curious but not curious enough to join #emacs as a vim user |
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| 21:22:36 | <yushyin> | try donald-bot in #latex then, afaik it is the same software |
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| 22:20:59 | <alexfmpe[m]> | is there a 'standard' library for semigroup actions? |
| 22:21:38 | <alexfmpe[m]> | I'm mostly looking for something that'd allow me multiplying numbers by vector-ish stuff |
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| 22:24:35 | <alexfmpe[m]> | and Num just makes me want to pull my hair out |
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| 22:31:31 | <Jadeitits[m]> | how would semigroups help here |
| 22:31:57 | <Jadeitits[m]> | your question seems to be asymmetric in types so it wouldnt help would it |
| 22:32:05 | <alexfmpe[m]> | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semigroup_action#Formal_definitions |
| 22:32:26 | <geekosaur> | yeh, this makes mathematical sense, not necessarily Haskell Semigroup sense |
| 22:32:55 | <alexfmpe[m]> | as I understand it, the semigroup acting here would be Product, and the other type could be vector/matrix-ish stuff |
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| 22:33:13 | <alexfmpe[m]> | data Semigroup s => SemigroupAction s x where |
| 22:33:13 | <alexfmpe[m]> | act :: s -> x -> x |
| 22:33:16 | <alexfmpe[m]> | something like this? |
| 22:33:33 | <alexfmpe[m]> | I know there was a kmett talk about this somewhere |
| 22:33:41 | <Jadeitits[m]> | I think constraints in types are deprecated |
| 22:33:52 | <alexfmpe[m]> | oops, that was meant to be class |
| 22:33:56 | <alexfmpe[m]> | not data |
| 22:35:37 | <c_wraith> | he mentioned the idea in his blog, if nothing else |
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| 22:38:27 | <alexfmpe[m]> | https://github.com/sheaf/acts#comparison ok this is what I was looking for |
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| 22:51:45 | <ddellacosta> | jean-paul[m]: fyi, I couldn't figure out how to get lsp-avy-lens working for me to apply hints, but I finally discovered lsp-ui-sideline-apply-code-actions in lsp-ui, which does it |
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| 23:18:49 | <jean-paul[m]> | ddellacosta: Interesting. For me, lsp-ui-sideline-apply-code-actions finds no code actions - just like lsp-execute-code-action ... except just now, on my 20th attempt to use lsp-execute-code-action, it worked. |
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