Logs on 2023-09-29 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 02:23:03 | <wroathe> | I'm loving how impossible it is to get understandable heap statistics using GHC. The built-in heap profiler was a dead end, and now I'm trying to get ghc-debug to work which has the funny problem where, when you start up the stub server in the program you're trying to debug, it listens for debug commands on a separate thread than your main thread, and if you use the `pause` function to pause your program |
| 02:23:09 | <wroathe> | at a specific point (which pauses on the main thread) and then later on connect with a client to run a command the GHC RTS dies with "error: %s: called from a different OS thread than rts_pause." |
| 02:24:09 | <wroathe> | Do Haskell programmers just not do any memory profiling? Am I alone in thinking that the built-in heap profiler requiring you to generate a postscript file and use ghostviewer is terrible? |
| 02:29:29 | <wroathe> | Live action footage of me trying to measure my Haskell program: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbSehcT19u0 |
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| 02:40:38 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> it is complex indeed, with many different tools, but should be possible |
| 02:41:09 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> you know about plain old +RTS -s or +RTS -S ? |
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| 02:43:57 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> #ghc should know |
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| 03:11:34 | <monochrom> | The built-in heap profiler is not a dead end to me. I now use -eventlog (compile-time) and -l (run-time) and https://hackage.haskell.org/package/eventlog2html . This replaces the postscript output. |
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| 03:20:47 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> oh, thanks for help mauke , forgot to say so |
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| 05:23:23 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> I don't want to bother the cabal team, but what's this feature? @? |
| 05:23:55 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> ```hs |
| 05:24:17 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> This is part of the initial parser |
| 05:24:24 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> http://localhost:20662/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/IkFNnpuLhOhCoROevcHBdxZU |
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| 06:10:34 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> it might be what's called "argument files" ? where an argument @foofile is replaced by the cli opts/args listed in that file |
| 06:10:46 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> seems on topic for the cabal team |
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| 06:17:27 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> Yup, my concern is that I simply don't want to bother you guys too much. I'm admittedly substantially lesser skilled, and I don't want to prove an annoyance against your normal work. |
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| 06:30:12 | <mauke> | <Inst> http://localhost:20662/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/IkFNnpuLhOhCoROevcHBdxZU |
| 06:30:16 | <mauke> | ^ that's not going to work |
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| 06:39:57 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> oh crap :( |
| 06:39:58 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> https://matrix-client.matrix.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/IkFNnpuLhOhCoROevcHBdxZU |
| 06:40:12 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> Seems to be an issue with Haskellbridge. |
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| 06:45:05 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> sm: maybe here instead? |
| 06:45:18 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> My impression is that the Cabal team is overworked and I don't want to bother them with unnecessary conversations. |
| 06:45:35 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> I've promised to update their Wiki by 2024 April 2nd, I'm trying to add commenting on their code base |
| 06:46:38 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> My original goal was to understand the internal parser enough to reverse an exact parser out of it |
| 06:46:41 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> but it's all yakshaving |
| 06:46:45 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I'm chatting with you in the cabal project room because I think it's the right place, unless cabal devs say otherwise. Improving cabal docs is normal and valuable work. |
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| 06:48:10 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> I can be quite a chatterbox and annoying, so I'd rather keep things to strict business there. |
| 06:49:23 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> you're getting down to business imho. And it's not less chatty here 😁 |
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| 06:52:39 | <[exa]> | what's wrong with haskellbridge? (except it's a little annoying to look at from irc :D ) |
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| 07:08:22 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> Yeah, it should be tomsmeding's? |
| 07:08:39 | <haskellbridge> | <Inst> mauke reported an issue with image linking :( |
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| 07:18:04 | <Axman6> | How do I make cabal generate haddock for all deps, and then tell me where the docs are? cabal haddock --haddock-all seems to do... something but I can't find the docs |
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| 07:23:08 | <dminuoso> | Axman6: Use --builddir= |
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| 07:24:31 | <dminuoso> | Axman6: Or well, if you dont specify further, it ends up in dist-newstyle. |
| 07:25:00 | <Axman6> | There are no hrtml files in dist-newstyle |
| 07:25:03 | <Axman6> | html* |
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| 07:30:28 | <dminuoso> | Axman6: When I execute the command, it ends up saying something like: Documentation created: /Users/dminuoso/projects/wobcom/haskell/powerdns-gerd/docs/build/aarch64-osx/ghc-9.2.8/powerdns-gerd-0.1.2/t/powerdns-gerd-test/doc/html/powerdns-gerd/powerdns-gerd-test/index.html |
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| 09:55:27 | <Guest46> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/n8RFJo2F |
| 09:56:28 | <Guest46> | What does symbol `|` mean in a type? |
| 10:03:29 | <cpressey> | Guest46: It introduces a functional dependency. https://ghc.gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/doc/users_guide/exts/functional_dependencies.html |
| 10:03:54 | <Guest46> | thx |
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| 10:10:32 | <dminuoso> | Guest46: Take note, that the | is not part of the type itself. |
| 10:10:47 | <dminuoso> | It's part of a class (or type family) definition, but not of a type. |
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| 11:08:55 | <Pozyomka> | Hello, I have a problem, which is difficult to explain directly, so I will start with a smaller example. Notice that if y = coth(x), then dy/dx = 1 - y^2. Then all the derivatives of y (w.r.t. x) can be expressed as polynomials in y with integer coefficients. And this Haskell program computes these polynomials: https://ideone.com/W5v0DT |
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| 11:10:29 | <Pozyomka> | Now I want to do something similar for y = x coth(x). Now, dy/dx = x + y(y-1)/x, so, instead of a polynomial in y with integer coefficients, I have a polynomial in y with coefficients in Z[x,1/x]. |
| 11:11:23 | <Pozyomka> | What would be an easy way to manipulate elements of Z[x,1/x] in Haskell? |
| 11:13:44 | <opqdonut> | you could write a Num instance for something like GeneralizedPolynomial [Integer] [Integer] |
| 11:14:19 | <opqdonut> | where the first list is the coefficients of 1,x,x^2... and the second list is the coefficients of 1/x,1/x^2,... |
| 11:14:43 | <opqdonut> | there might even be something like this in a library |
| 11:15:00 | <Pozyomka> | Yeah, if there were a library for this kind of thing, it would be amazing. |
| 11:15:20 | <opqdonut> | perhaps: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/poly-0.5.1.0/docs/Data-Poly-Laurent.html |
| 11:15:39 | <Pozyomka> | Thanks! |
| 11:16:05 | <opqdonut> | I've never used that library so I can't vouch for it :) |
| 11:17:08 | <Pozyomka> | I'll give it a try anyway. Thanks! |
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| 11:21:55 | <[Leary]> | Pozyomka: If you just want polynomials in x and 1/x, you can express them by extending your polynomial type with a single Int factor, such that (poly, n) corresponds to poly / x^n. This shouldn't be much harder to manipulate. |
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| 11:22:39 | <Pozyomka> | Oh, right. That works too. I have no idea how I could miss it. |
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| 11:40:56 | <oo_miguel> | Hello, I have troubles understanding the following notation. What does it do? Please help: "case f a of x { _ -> g x b}" |
| 11:45:46 | <ncf> | that's a parse error |
| 11:46:02 | <ncf> | where did you see that? |
| 11:46:41 | <oo_miguel> | https://youtu.be/5vKBFnTsCcE?t=1449 |
| 11:47:07 | <oo_miguel> | maybe its meant to be "case f a of x -> g x b" ? |
| 11:48:14 | <ncf> | oh that's Core i bet |
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| 11:51:42 | <oo_miguel> | ooh ok, then I'd love to know the equivalent Haskell notation |
| 11:51:57 | <ncf> | i'm unsure if x is meant to be a type there |
| 11:53:57 | <ncf> | ok no x is the variable that the case expression binds |
| 11:54:11 | <ncf> | so that would correspond to case f a of x -> g x b in Haskell |
| 11:55:01 | <ncf> | https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/wikis/commentary/compiler/core-syn-type#case-expressions |
| 11:56:41 | <oo_miguel> | make sense, thanks a lot! |
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| 12:25:15 | <tomsmeding> | Inst: haskellbridge is not mine? |
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| 12:27:38 | <exarkun> | I believe geekosaur set it up. |
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| 12:32:11 | tomsmeding | thought so too |
| 12:32:25 | <tomsmeding> | the fact that my name is in the logger and the pastebin doesn't mean that I run this channel lol |
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| 12:44:39 | <Inst> | Yeah, I got confused, it was Geekosaur. |
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| 13:28:58 | <exarkun> | Anyone know how to turn off the ... uh ... hls "explicit type declaration lens"(???) in emacs for instance definitions? |
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| 13:34:33 | <c_wraith> | IIRC, a lens in language-server terminology is a view that provides additional details when you're focusing on something in particular. like moving your cursor over a specific bit of code. (I have no idea how to turn it off, but I can provide some explanation for the name) |
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| 13:37:13 | <exarkun> | hm. the thing I mean is where it suggests a type signature for things that don't have a type signature. they show up all the time, not just when my cursor is on the thing. for normal top-levels, I like it. for functions in an instance definition, less so. |
| 13:37:32 | <haskellbridge> | <eldritchcookie> hello compdata has many monadTrans like classes, i would like to derive them with GHC generics, they don't fit neatly in kind k -> Type so my ideas is to use a wrapper of kind((Type->Type)->Type-> Type) -> (Type->Type,Type)-> Type so i derive generic1 wrapper mt which does fit into k -> Type i am having difficulties writing the wrapper as i can't pattern match on the |
| 13:37:32 | <haskellbridge> | (Type -> Typ <clipped message> |
| 13:37:33 | <haskellbridge> | <eldritchcookie> e, Type) kinded type can i do this without type families? |
| 13:38:07 | <tomsmeding> | exarkun: yeah that's still a lens; HLS would need to have a setting to disable certain "code lenses" (that's the full jargon), or emacs would need to have such a setting |
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| 13:38:28 | <tomsmeding> | I know of neither but I don't use emacs and know little of HLS' config interface, so that does not say much |
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| 13:44:16 | <[Leary]> | % data Uncurry f t where Uncurry :: f x y -> Uncurry f '(x, y) |
| 13:44:16 | <yahb2> | <no output> |
| 13:44:20 | <[Leary]> | % :k Uncurry |
| 13:44:20 | <yahb2> | Uncurry :: (k1 -> k2 -> *) -> (k1, k2) -> * |
| 13:44:31 | <exarkun> | I just read through all of the lsp-mode and lsp-haskell-mode config items and didn't see anything related, so I guess not :/ |
| 13:44:40 | <[Leary]> | eldritchcookie: ^ |
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| 13:46:19 | <exarkun> | There is an option to render them above the line instead of to the right of it, and an option to turn them _all_ off. |
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| 13:48:06 | <ddellacosta> | exarkun: this may be a lsp-ui thing? https://github.com/emacs-lsp/lsp-ui --I have a bunch of specific options set in my emacs haskell-mode lsp-ui settings, including setq lsp-ui-sideline-show-hover f), maybe relevant? |
| 13:48:15 | <ddellacosta> | whoops bad paste, sorry |
| 13:48:40 | <ddellacosta> | honestly it's been a while since I fiddled with it |
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| 13:51:26 | <exarkun> | huh, why aren't lsp-ui options a subgroup of lsp options :/ |
| 13:51:45 | <ddellacosta> | I wish I could answer that |
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| 14:14:03 | <AreolaElbows> | Mrs. Sk1lt0n and Jean Pierre Manikariza (12 inch member) from Regina, Saskatchewan make love using poutine as an aphrodisiac! (The sensation of the warm poutine on their skin was unlike anything they had experienced before. Edna felt a shiver run down her spine as Jean Pierre took a handful of the fries and placed them on her chest, letting the gravy run down her curves. She closed her eyes and let out a soft sigh, feeling the warm liquid pool |
| 14:14:03 | <AreolaElbows> | in the crevices between her breasts.) https://pastebin.com/Ta1Q8qy1 |
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| 14:17:58 | <danse-nr3> | interesting AreolaElbows |
| 14:18:06 | <AreolaElbows> | Richard Simmons gets dateraped by Regina native Edna Skilton. Read about the drama involving hockey, roofies, and flabby elbows! https://pastes.io/3zb8ipyqbv |
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| 14:18:44 | <danse-nr3> | i think #haskell gets more of these than other channels i am in |
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| 14:20:19 | <danse-nr3> | and they quit before we are even able to do anything XD ... well, not an op, not sure what i could do |
| 14:22:21 | <exarkun> | That one didn't quite, they were k-lined, so I guess whatever needed happening happened. |
| 14:22:24 | <exarkun> | s/quite/quit/ |
| 14:22:41 | <danse-nr3> | oh, right |
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| 14:39:08 | <geekosaur> | pop into #haskell-ops when needed |
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| 14:48:22 | <exarkun> | If a library hides an IO behind an unsafePerformIO but I want to be sure the IO is resolved before certain other expressions are evaluated (eg following lines in a `do` block) ... can I? |
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| 14:49:03 | <exarkun> | (I already contributed a change to the library to unhide the IO but I wonder if I can do anything until I can rely on that fix being available) |
| 14:52:17 | <geekosaur> | not that I'm aware of |
| 14:53:34 | <ncf> | seq? |
| 14:55:02 | <exarkun> | I think not seq because seq only says if the result of seq is evaluated, the first argument to seq is evaluated to whnf. |
| 14:55:21 | <exarkun> | So it just shifts the problem over to ensuring the result of seq is evaluated in a timely manner. |
| 14:55:59 | <tomsmeding> | :t evaluate |
| 14:56:00 | <lambdabot> | a -> IO a |
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| 14:56:09 | <tomsmeding> | exarkun: that's what Control.Exception.evaluate is for |
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| 14:56:16 | <exarkun> | Oo |
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| 14:56:40 | <tomsmeding> | of course whnf only |
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| 14:57:47 | <exarkun> | Good enough, I think. Can't find the whnf without doing the IO. Thanks. |
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| 15:03:31 | <danse-nr3> | thanks geekosaur |
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| 15:37:00 | TheCatCollective | is now known as CalculusCat |
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| 16:12:50 | <exarkun> | is https://hackage.haskell.org/package/crypto-api-0.13.3/docs/Crypto-Classes.html#v:keyLengthBytes a trick? ByteLength is just a type alias for Int ... and it is defined right next to BitLength |
| 16:13:30 | <exarkun> | I mean, not a trick I guess. But that Tagged type is a bit meaningless? |
| 16:13:53 | <exarkun> | it unifies with `keyLengthBytes :: Tagged a BitLength` |
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| 16:17:13 | <monochrom> | The tag is k, and there is a requirement BlockCipher k. |
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| 16:32:39 | <exarkun> | humm ok, I guess that makes some sense |
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| 22:13:44 | <wroathe> | Hey with ghcup is there a way to print the path to the include dir for the current ghc version? |
| 22:14:02 | <wroathe> | The sitaution is that the C extension for vscode can't find the ghc header files |
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| 22:21:20 | <glguy> | wroathe: there's ghcup whereis to start from |
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| 23:28:02 | <zaraksh> | @pl f x = x |
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| 23:37:44 | <dsal> | Does anyone know how to make my software build on a mac without nix? Someone opened a bug about not being able to find libpq (from homebrew) and I've jettisoned any memory of how to work in less controlled environments. :) |
| 23:38:22 | <glguy> | which is your software? |
| 23:38:51 | <glguy> | or more specifically, which postgresql binding do you use? |
| 23:47:21 | <dsal> | I'm using hasql. |
| 23:48:20 | <dsal> | I'm not doing anything particularly fancy. Just stack + nix with `packages: [zlib, postgresql]` in the nix config. |
| 23:51:36 | <glguy> | dsal: to build it I needed to put pg_config into my $PATH |
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| 23:52:09 | <glguy> | the default for the postgresql-libpq package is to look for pg_config, depending on the architecture that'd be in /opt/homebrew/opt/postgresql@16/bin or /usr/local/opt/postgresql@16/bin |
| 23:52:29 | <glguy> | postgresql-libpq also has mode where it would use pkg-config to build |
| 23:52:51 | <glguy> | In that case the user would have to set PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/opt/homebrew/opt/postgresql@16/lib/pkgconfig |
| 23:52:54 | <glguy> | when building |
| 23:52:58 | <dsal> | Oh interesting. Let me see if that helps other people. I suppose the right thing to do is set up a temporary account and install homebrew and see if I can make it work. |
| 23:53:01 | <dsal> | Thanks for the clue in any case. |
All times are in UTC on 2023-09-29.