Logs on 2023-12-01 (liberachat/#haskell)

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00:20:28	<dostoyevsky2>	how accurate is it to state `UNIX pipes (treated semantically as writing to temporary files) are quite similar to monads' https://www.okmij.org/ftp/Computation/monadic-shell.html
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00:25:21	<EvanR>	not
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00:27:05	<c_wraith>	can you send a pipe through a pipe?
00:27:54	<EvanR>	coaxial pipe
00:28:02	<EvanR>	burrito pipe
00:28:27	<c_wraith>	I still don't really understand burritos, even after that paper explaining them in terms of monads.
00:29:07	<dostoyevsky2>	c_wraith: https://www.emuplumbing.com.au/wp-content/uploads/brawoliner_0.jpg
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00:32:37	<geekosaur>	but you can send a pipe through a local socket 😛
00:34:29	<dostoyevsky2>	> echo "echo 'pipe for you' \| cat" \| sh # -> pipe for you
00:34:30	<lambdabot>	<hint>:1:34: error: parse error on input ‘\|’
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04:11:15	int-e	wonders whether glguy is going to announce his AoC leaderboard again this year
04:11:42	<glguy>	43100-84040706
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04:11:59	<glguy>	There are a couple of slots open - I need to clean out people who haven't been active for a couple years
04:13:05	<EvanR>	woo I didn't get cleaned out
04:13:35	<int-e>	yet ;)
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04:15:33	<glguy>	EvanR: knock out the easy one tonight to refresh your activity level ahead of me going through to find in actives :)
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04:16:44	<int-e>	EvanR was active last year, I suppse that makes him safe regardless
04:16:45	<EvanR>	prepped for 11PM
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04:19:29	<glguy>	oh, even better
04:21:33	<iqubic>	If I was in there from years past, will I still be in there?
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04:23:21	<EvanR>	yes unless glguy clears you out
04:23:38	glguy	goes mad with power
04:23:57	<glguy>	\o/ muhahahaha
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05:32:05	<EvanR>	wow why isn't my code apparently working for part 2
05:32:13	<EvanR>	not a good start to the new year
05:32:55	<int-e>	EvanR: it's by design... and slightly annoying tbh
05:33:18	<EvanR>	this is the first time "my code works on the example but not the input" that I've heard so much about
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05:36:04	<jle`>	yeah i feel like for a Day 1, they should be covering this in the examples
05:38:22	<int-e>	or be clearer in the spec
05:39:39	<glguy>	It felt more like they were sloppy than sneaky to me
05:41:44	<EvanR>	step 1 understand the question
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05:45:54	<EvanR>	ok
05:47:01	<int-e>	glguy: I don't know... wouldn't basically every beta-tester (and there are several) be expected run into this?
05:47:10	<int-e>	+to
05:47:50	<int-e>	I guess that can go wrong if there are more than two iterations of the example(s).
05:47:53	<glguy>	Maybe? But they've made mistakes before. I'm just trying to give the benefit of the doubt, but I don't know
05:48:38	<int-e>	Sure. I mean whether by design or not, there's no actual malice here.
05:48:49	<EvanR>	that you know of
05:49:22	<EvanR>	maybe eric wants to watch aoc burn this year xD
05:50:29	<int-e>	tomorrow "your input represents a turing machine. determine whether it halts."
05:52:27	<int-e>	(That's how I would burn a competition site... find a problem type that has both easy and impossible instances. Though coming up with an oracle for that may be a bit tricky :-P)
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05:54:49	<mauke>	haven't tried part 2 yet, but the spec is ambiguous
05:55:45	<mauke>	does "oneight" count as 18?
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06:03:14	<EvanR>	come on, if it was written clearly then everyone would be able to read it
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06:03:19	<EvanR>	if it was easy everyone could do it
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06:10:33	<int-e>	FWIW I think the spec is, ultimately, fine. But the relevant information that has to be pieced together is spaced quite far apart.
06:11:13	<EvanR>	I read it over and over and I'm curious why you think this xD
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06:15:09	<monochrom>	ON EIGHT GOTO 15
06:15:13	<monochrom>	REM >:)
06:15:36	<int-e>	rapid eye movement twitches
06:15:57	<EvanR>	on eight goto 15 sounds like the stand up maths cogputer video
06:16:15	<EvanR>	now that's a brain grinder
06:16:27	<int-e>	> map toUpper "please abstain from coming from"
06:16:29	<lambdabot>	"PLEASE ABSTAIN FROM COMING FROM"
06:17:04	<EvanR>	caps lock for some reason doesn't make ' into " or numbers into !@#$
06:17:13	<EvanR>	that used to work on my mechanical typewriter
06:17:34	<EvanR>	otherwise it would be easier than writing haskell to do it
06:17:38	<int-e>	well, that would be a shift-lock
06:17:41	<int-e>	not a caps-lock
06:17:48	<int-e>	;)
06:17:52	<EvanR>	lol
06:18:58	<int-e>	EvanR: I also have mapped that key to, uhm, Mod3
06:19:20	<EvanR>	what key
06:19:32	<int-e>	The one labelled "Caps Lock"
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06:26:02	<EvanR>	@hoogle [Maybe a] -> a
06:26:03	<lambdabot>	Graphics.Matplotlib.Internal minimum2 :: (Ord (t a), Ord a, Foldable t1, Foldable t) => t1 (t a) -> a
06:26:03	<lambdabot>	Graphics.Matplotlib.Internal maximum2 :: (Ord (t a), Ord a, Foldable t1, Foldable t) => t1 (t a) -> a
06:26:03	<lambdabot>	DBus.Generation runGetFirst :: [Maybe a] -> Maybe a
06:26:14	<EvanR>	:t getFirst
06:26:15	<lambdabot>	First a -> Maybe a
06:26:43	<EvanR>	yes, what I asked for it unsafe bad and evil
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06:34:48	<int-e>	who's on first?
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06:37:13	<int-e>	EvanR: interestingly, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caps_Lock#History makes that exact distinction in terminology.
06:38:02	<EvanR>	it could very well have said literally shift lock on the key for all I (don't) remember
06:38:17	<EvanR>	it's crazy when jargon makes sense
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06:39:05	<int-e>	It gets weird when things are anachronistic, like hanging up your phone [receiver].
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07:55:39	<EvanR>	int-e, in 6023 researchers likely won't give a damn that people in 2123 were still using floppy disk icon for "save", the time difference is close enough xD
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08:08:40	<monochrom>	Inspired by "abstain from": A new construct "ABSTAIN FROM" such that eg "ABSTAIN FROM 30, 40" means that if you jump from line 40 or 50 to it, it aborts or returns or... I'm open to suggestions, anything except normal execution flow. >:)
08:09:19	<int-e>	monochrom: read the Intercal manual
08:09:37	<monochrom>	onoes, it already has it?
08:09:54	<monochrom>	What did intercal not think of? :D
08:10:17	<monochrom>	Does it have dependent types too?
08:10:20	<int-e>	It has, among other things, COME FROM, ABSTAIN FROM, and REINSTATE. Oh and a politeness requirement for programs.
08:11:23	<monochrom>	Like this? PRINT "HELLO" WHEN YOU ARE READY
08:11:37	<int-e>	It also has BASIC-like labeled statements and ABSTRAIN FROM and REINSTATE work on statements.
08:11:47	<int-e>	There are no strings.
08:12:04	<jackdk>	. and : are the two sizes of integer IIRC
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08:13:26	<monochrom>	oooohhhhh.... Take Pascal but s/begin/please/ and s/end/thank you/ >:)
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08:21:25	<EvanR>	no strings makes sense
08:21:48	<EvanR>	unless you have 36 bit words and limit your strings to 5 or less ascii chars
08:22:57	<EvanR>	else it's the odd one out among "basic types" for taking up so much space
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09:08:11	<tomsmeding>	C be live "basic types"?
09:08:13	<tomsmeding>	*like
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09:17:26	<Flonk>	It's been a while. I've set up a new stack project, and I'm trying to do `import Data.Text.IO (readFile)`. It says I don't have text in my build-depends in my cabal file. `stack install text` didn't seem to resolve the issue.
09:21:40	<Flonk>	This exact example is literally in the docs, you're a dumass Flonk
09:21:43	<Flonk>	no u Flonk
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09:29:02	<dminuoso_>	Sigh, Im so tempted to use HDBC to interact with this postgresql.
09:29:21	<dminuoso_>	hasql has a dependency footprint rivaling that of npm hosted web frameworks
09:29:35	<dminuoso_>	postgresql Im deeply unhappy with :(
09:29:54	<dminuoso_>	Are there folks here who still use HDBC? If yes, why?
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09:31:40	<dminuoso_>	Or maybe I should just use postgresql-libpq directly and avoid all the pain.
09:33:22	<danse-nr3>	not sure how many layers are you on top of but if that is one layer closer to the problem often that helps, yes
09:36:16	<dminuoso_>	For this problem, I just need two select and one insert statement.
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09:37:28	<probie>	Just shell out to `psql`?
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09:39:04	<Flonk>	I'm trying to distribute a file alongside my exe now. adding `data-files: assets/input.txt` under `executables` in my package.yaml doesn't seem to do it. At least, `getDataFileName "assets/input.txt"` doesn't find anything.
09:39:39	<Flonk>	`stack build` also doesn't include a `data-files` section in the auto-generated cabal file.
09:40:24	<dminuoso_>	probie: Mmm, so that actually brought up an interesting idea. I could just slap postgrest ontop of it. While yes, this has hasql and loads of moving parts inside, its just an nix closure for me and doenst impact the dependency closure of my program.
09:40:59	<dminuoso_>	Think I dont really get around to doing my "mini-hasql" fork.
09:41:20	<danse-nr3>	one of the most brilliant haskell projects i have seen in the past years
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10:23:28	<tomsmeding>	Flonk: to use data-files you'll need to install your program using e.g. `stack install`; the installed executable will have access to the file
10:23:35	<tomsmeding>	if I'm not mistaken
10:24:04	<tomsmeding>	there may or may not be a way to find that file in the non-installed state with `stack run`, but I don't know of any (never used data-files much)
10:24:33	<Flonk>	tomsmeding, stack build and stack exec worked, I just put `data-files` in the wrong place in my package.yaml (and was missing `data-dir` I think)
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10:25:13	<tomsmeding>	ah :)
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13:06:41	<slack1256>	does anybody know if you can bump the filepath version or is that shipped with ghc? Is it a boot library?
13:08:35	<dminuoso_>	slack1256: Its a boot library, but that doesnt prevent you from bumping the version.
13:09:15	<dminuoso_>	Assuming you use cabal here, cabal-install can manage many concurrent versions - use GHC boot libraries or install the ones it wants from hackage.
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13:11:24	<slack1256>	I am guessing that is different on stack/stackage resolvers? If i declared it as an extra dep it yells loudly.
13:11:38	<dminuoso_>	I cant tell you anything about stack, sorry.
13:11:51	<slack1256>	haha np
13:11:55	<slack1256>	thanks
13:12:12	<dminuoso_>	slack1256: care to share how stack complains?
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13:17:38	<slack1256>	https://pastebin.com/vSk7SPwg
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13:18:13	<slack1256>	this is after setting filepath-1.4.100.0 on extra deps
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13:19:31	<slack1256>	i feel this is invalidating the other boot libraries somehow
13:20:05	<dminuoso_>	slack1256: https://github.com/commercialhaskell/stack/issues/4897
13:20:16	<dminuoso_>	Right. See the issue,
13:20:26	<dminuoso_>	Relatedly https://github.com/commercialhaskell/stack/issues/4510
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13:22:22	<slack1256>	that was right there on the error message... Thanks you a lot dminuoso_
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15:13:55	<ph88>	I'm trying to install dhall lsp server https://github.com/dhall-lang/dhall-haskell/tree/main/dhall-lsp-server#installation and getting some errors https://bpa.st/M3EQ ? what's going on here? i always use stack never cabal
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16:04:51	<c_wraith>	lortabac: I spent some time looking at GHC.TypeLits in more detail, as well as what you were trying to do. And... I have no idea why GHC.TypeLits provides SNat now, because it sort of misses the point of singletons to have them without having value-level versions of the type operators for them.
16:05:24	<lortabac>	c_wraith: IIRC the documentation mentions a pattern-synonym
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16:06:06	<lortabac>	maybe you can do something like (case of Snat 0 -> _) ?
16:06:35	<lortabac>	TBH I haven't had the time to look at this problem yet
16:06:40	<c_wraith>	the documentation for all three singleton's pattern synonyms is wrong in the same way, fwiw. a silly typo, but it really makes them lie
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16:07:20	<c_wraith>	The pattern synonyms don't do anything that you don't get from natVal and someNatVal
16:07:30	<lortabac>	oh strange
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16:08:20	<lortabac>	so, is it possible to define my 'generate' function with this module?
16:08:36	<c_wraith>	Not in a way the type systems knows is correct.
16:08:49	<c_wraith>	https://paste.tomsmeding.com/I2hpWpM9 but if you're willing to... help...
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16:10:10	<lortabac>	haha unsafeCoerce
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16:10:36	<c_wraith>	It's perfectly safe in that use case. The type isn't changing, you're just telling GHC "I know this is safe"
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16:10:54	<c_wraith>	It's like the use case it legitimately is intended for
16:11:00	<lortabac>	yes
16:11:29	<c_wraith>	But yeah, it should be hidden behind something inside the GHC.TypeLits, not forced on you as the user
16:12:33	<lortabac>	I'll try to have a look when I have time, but I doubt I'll be able to do more than what you already did
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16:13:48	<lortabac>	I guess it wouldn't work even with 'sameNat'
16:13:54	<c_wraith>	There are ways to not run into that. The most direct is to not use Nat in the definition of the type. The problem is specifically related to Nat.
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16:14:38	<c_wraith>	Alternatively, there is a type checker plugin that magically creates KnownNat instances so that KnownNat n does actually imply KnownNat (n+1)
16:15:56	<c_wraith>	A third alternative is to lobby for GHC.TypeLits to get functions that reflect the arithmetic type families. So you would have something like `sPlus :: SNat m -> SNat n -> SNat (m + n)`. That would be sufficient
16:16:16	<c_wraith>	But it depends on a hypothetical future release of GHC
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16:23:01	<lortabac>	c_wraith: what do you mean by "not using Nat"?
16:23:12	<lortabac>	defining your own inductive type?
16:23:16	<c_wraith>	yes
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16:24:38	<lortabac>	I have something similar in one of my projects, I was hoping I could get rid of my types and use GHC's Nat
16:24:58	<lortabac>	but AFAICS it's premature
16:25:14	<c_wraith>	As things stand, Nat is more useful as part of an external-facing library interface than for internal use to help maintain invariants.
16:26:21	<lortabac>	yes I guess so
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16:27:21	<lortabac>	I have to go now, I'll try to play a little bit with that module anyway
16:27:41	<lortabac>	just as an exercise
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17:30:46	<ncf>	@pl \ a (b, c) (d, e) -> a b c d e
17:30:46	<lambdabot>	(`ap` snd) . (. fst) . flip flip snd . ((flip . (ap .)) .) . flip flip fst . ((flip . ((.) .)) .)
17:30:54	<ncf>	does pl not know about uncurry
17:31:05	<ncf>	:t fmap uncurry . uncurry
17:31:06	<lambdabot>	(a1 -> b1 -> a2 -> b2 -> c) -> (a1, b1) -> (a2, b2) -> c
17:31:46	<monochrom>	@pl \x y -> f (x,y)
17:31:46	<lambdabot>	(f .) . (,)
17:32:13	<monochrom>	Oh, that is a bit disappointing, it doesn't say uncurry f.
17:32:52	<monochrom>	But it is not an LLM so it does not give idiomatic answers. :)
17:33:21	<glguy>	The answer with all the operators is much more syntactically impressive, and isn't that why you'd use ?pl in the first place?
17:33:56	<monochrom>	But I was not impressed. :)
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17:34:33	<monochrom>	Syntactically impressive but not tactically impressive :)
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17:50:30	<Franciman>	speaking about ATS monochrom ?
17:50:32	<Franciman>	:P
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19:35:02	<tomsmeding>	monochrom: it's supposed to be impressive to people who aren't _quite_ comfortable with the orthodox church of pointfree programming
19:35:06	<tomsmeding>	you are not the audience :p
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19:37:49	<monochrom>	Yeah I'm with the presbyterian church of pointfree programming!
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19:38:52	<darkling>	Reformed, or Recidivist?
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20:20:20	<ski>	hm, iirc Conor McBride talks about presbyterian vs. anglican (iirc ?) parameters of type families (and, by analogy, of GADTs, presumably)
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20:28:10	<tomsmeding>	% :t Control.Monad.ST.runST
20:28:10	<yahb2>	Control.Monad.ST.runST :: (forall s. GHC.ST.ST s a) -> a
20:28:42	<tomsmeding>	this 'a' is of kind Type and cannot be instantiated to an unlifted type
20:29:04	<tomsmeding>	so I cannot execute an ST action that produces an unlifted type, like a ByteArray#, using runST
20:29:15	<tomsmeding>	should I just temporarily wrap it in a lifted data type, or what?
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20:35:07	<EvanR>	levity polymorphism doesn't save you?
20:35:41	<EvanR>	or it would if the type signature explicitly used it?
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20:36:25	<tomsmeding>	I think the latter
20:36:55	<tomsmeding>	this is my first time dabbling in # # # code, so I'm a bit out of my depth :p
20:38:26	<EvanR>	wasn't runST the whole reason for adding levity, or was that $
20:38:37	<tomsmeding>	iirc that was ($)
20:39:03	<tomsmeding>	"($) is fully representation-polymorphic." https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.19.0.0/docs/Prelude.html#v:-36-
20:40:12	<EvanR>	time to hack your own version of runST xD
20:40:12	<tomsmeding>	side remark: runST being levity polymorphic would be pointless without the ST monad itself being the same :p
20:40:19	<EvanR>	oh
20:40:42	<tomsmeding>	I mean, the implementation of runST isn't even complicated, it just calls some runRW# function; it isn't even NOINLINE
20:40:52	<tomsmeding>	but I already data Wrap (a :: UnliftedType) = Wrap !a
20:40:52	<tomsmeding>	:p
20:41:22	<tomsmeding>	clumsy though: case unsafeFreezeByteArray# mba s of (# s, ba #) -> (# s, Wrap ba #)
20:41:37	<tomsmeding>	er, ST (\s -> case unsafeFreezeByteArray# mba s of (# s, ba #) -> (# s, Wrap ba #))
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20:43:33	<ski>	tomsmeding : something like `codenseST :: (forall s o. (a -> ST s o) -> ST s o) -> a' might work, possibly ?
20:44:20	tomsmeding	raises the mind a bit higher to read that type
20:44:46	<tomsmeding>	oh ok
20:44:47	<EvanR>	that type is the codensest
20:45:13	<tomsmeding>	ski: because then you juggle things so that you never put 'a' in ST?
20:45:14	<ski>	(basically `(forall s. Codensity (ST s) a) -> a')
20:45:19	<ski>	yes
20:45:34	<tomsmeding>	_maybe_
20:45:46	<tomsmeding>	I only have to Wrap a few times though
20:45:56	<tomsmeding>	so it's okay
20:46:09	<ski>	sounds like such an operation could be useful, at least as a wrapper
20:46:29	<ski>	(and if you don't have to allocate a data constructor, all the better)
20:46:35	<tomsmeding>	why can ST itself not be levity polymorphic?
20:47:16	<tomsmeding>	maybe not allocate a data constructor, but you are allocating more function closures
20:47:35	<tomsmeding>	and if you can optimise those away, then there should also be nothing standing in the way of cancelling out the data constructors
20:47:37	<tomsmeding>	I'd hope
20:48:22	<EvanR>	another reason why DList vs List may not make sense ^
20:48:35	<int-e>	:t (>>=)
20:48:36	<lambdabot>	Monad m => m a -> (a -> m b) -> m b
20:48:39	<tomsmeding>	nah, that's avoiding O(n^2) behaviour :p
20:48:43	<EvanR>	because the assumption that data and closures are equally costly
20:48:45	<tomsmeding>	that's a real complexity improvement
20:49:14	<tomsmeding>	for small lists it may not matter, if if you're appending lots of long things left-associatively, that O(n^2) is going to bite you
20:49:19	<tomsmeding>	*but if
20:49:28	<EvanR>	(in the specific case of just appending to the end of a dlist instead of prepending to a list and reversing)
20:49:38	<tomsmeding>	ah sre
20:49:41	<tomsmeding>	*sure
20:50:21	tomsmeding	. o O ( newtype Reversed a = Reversed [a] ; runReversed (Reversed l) = reverse l ; instance Monoid (Reversed a) )
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20:51:24	<tomsmeding>	int-e: sorry, I'm not getting your hint :)
20:51:45	<EvanR>	Reversed a <> Reversed b = Reversed (b <> a) -- ?xD
20:52:03	<tomsmeding>	clearly
20:52:22	<tomsmeding>	also inject :: [a] -> Reversed a ; inject l = Reversed (reverse l)
20:52:55	<tomsmeding>	oh it's clearly better to have 'newtype Reversed a = Reversed [[a]]'
20:53:04	<tomsmeding>	chunks are in forward order, outer list is in reverse order
20:53:09	<tomsmeding>	less reversing work at the end
20:53:43	<EvanR>	cut to the chase and do JList a = Empty \| Leaf a \| Join (JList a) (JList a) xD
20:53:55	<EvanR>	O(1)
20:54:07	<tomsmeding>	O(n)
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20:54:13	<EvanR>	the same cost advertised by DList
20:54:20	<int-e>	tomsmeding: AIUI, a can't be levity polymorphic in there because it's the argument of the a -> m b closure. So even if you do it for the ST type (which /probably/ works), you won't get a monad instance for that. I think.
20:54:39	<tomsmeding>	ah, right
20:54:56	<tomsmeding>	because the type of (>>=) can't be levity polymorphic, otherwise _all_ Monad instances would have to deal with that
20:55:06	<tomsmeding>	hence ST is not levity polymorphic either
20:55:10	<tomsmeding>	sad
20:55:38	<tomsmeding>	EvanR: does dlist advertise O(1) materialisation?
20:55:42	<tomsmeding>	that's patently false
20:55:50	<EvanR>	"O(1) concat" xD
20:55:56	<tomsmeding>	oh for sure
20:56:12	<tomsmeding>	you just pay O(n) at the end to materialise the final list
20:56:13	<EvanR>	as long as you don't look at the results you're blazing
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20:56:25	<tomsmeding>	I mean, the tree of closures you build with DList is essentially your JList :p
20:56:34	<EvanR>	that's what it seems like!
20:56:45	<int-e>	EvanR: if you don't look at the results you can use `(<>) = undefined`
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20:56:54	<EvanR>	would that speed it up?
20:57:06	<tomsmeding>	the difference being that with the dlist approach, GHC can automatically fuse 'a <> b <> c <> d' because it understands closures
20:57:29	<tomsmeding>	it doesn't understand that it can merge multiple Leafs connected by Joins together, that knowledge is contained in your materialisation function
20:57:30	<EvanR>	yes but earlier you were hoping it could "just" fuse data too
20:57:55	<tomsmeding>	that's about a data type that gets constructed close to where it's matched
20:57:56	<EvanR>	if it can't why can't it
20:58:12	<tomsmeding>	with your JList you build the stuff locally, and the materialisation may be far away
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20:58:21	<int-e>	EvanR: I don't know, does GHC manage to optimize `undefined a b` to `undefined`? If so, that will reduce the allocations of thunks while you're accumulating the value that you're never going to use.
20:58:25	<tomsmeding>	with DList, even if the materialisation is far away, multiple <> close together are still fusible
20:58:43	<tomsmeding>	fusable?
20:58:46	<tomsmeding>	fuseable?
20:58:53	<Inst>	Is trying to reverse engineer wordpress and port its MariaDB MySQL to haskell a viable introduction to web development?
20:59:16	<tomsmeding>	if you value neither time nor sanity
20:59:19	<EvanR>	for yourself or the general audience
20:59:37	<Inst>	tomsmeding: why is this generally untenable?
20:59:45	<EvanR>	general audience might revolt
21:00:02	<Inst>	myself, at least
21:00:09	<EvanR>	go for it
21:00:18	<tomsmeding>	because it's a big task, probably no one but you wants to use it in the end (if you survive), and it's not the most effective way to learn what's generally called "web development" :p
21:00:23	<johnw>	if I were looking for a small team to build a constraint verifier for a simple lambda calculus based functional language, do people know of anyone in or near academia who'd be interested in such a contract?
21:01:28	<Inst>	trying to save my relationship from the CIA (well, not really) by porting someone's wordpress-based high-revenue site to Haskell to save them money.
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21:04:03	<Inst>	and yes, this is intended to be comic
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21:16:25	<EvanR>	sans
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22:13:53	<seydar>	I am doing AOC #1 and I am unable to not think imperatively
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22:14:48	<seydar>	i'm out here trying to find the first occurrence of a substring, but this is not The Way
22:15:01	<seydar>	how do i fix my brain
22:15:17	<seydar>	and/or i am open to any advice people have
22:15:39	<c_wraith>	Try to decompose the problem into different steps
22:15:46	<monochrom>	Data.List has isInfixOf and related functions for finding substrings.
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22:15:51	<c_wraith>	Instead of finding the first substring, find all the substrings
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22:16:00	<c_wraith>	then grab the first one of them.
22:16:52	<glguy>	seydar: Why do you think that "find the first occurrence of a substring" is not the way?
22:18:26	<seydar>	glguy: because i was googling for finding the index of a substring and some random comment said "stop thinking imperatively, there's a reason this isn't included on strings"
22:19:07	<seydar>	c_wraith: that definitely feels more haskelly
22:19:23	<glguy>	I wouldn't put too much stock in any one comment you read on the internet. The main thing there was not to think about indexes because indexing a haskell list isn't efficient
22:19:27	<monochrom>	Perhaps the comment means stop wanting indexes.
22:19:33	<glguy>	next to nothing to do with imperative or not
22:19:44	<glguy>	returning the thing directly, instead of an index, is the main insight
22:20:50	<monochrom>	What would you do with the index anyway? Dereference it to get the substring? Now there is a fusion opportunity. (In your mental model, not in the computer.)
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22:22:17	<EvanR>	finding a subtract matching some criteria is pretty declarative
22:22:30	<EvanR>	except for the verb
22:22:34	<EvanR>	ignore that
22:22:35	<monochrom>	:)
22:22:42	<EvanR>	er substring
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22:22:48	<monochrom>	Yeah no worries, I think we get it.
22:23:34	<monochrom>	<troll>If I cancel a contract, that's a subtract.</troll>
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22:27:37	<EvanR>	I write a day 1 solution in elixir, ran the elixir program on it, it works great, and then I was told that I in fact solved day 1 entirely at compile time
22:28:06	<EvanR>	so now I think ruby, which is what elixir was trying to feel like, does everything at compile time xD
22:28:28	<EvanR>	and or don't know the difference anymore
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22:29:21	<monochrom>	Ruby evaluates terms at compile time, Hugs checks types at run time. This is a fun Friday. :D
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22:31:45	ChanServ	sets topic to "https://www.reddit.com/r/haskell \| Admin: #haskell-ops \| Offtopic: #haskell-offtopic \| https://downloads.haskell.org \| https://play.haskell.org/ \| Paste code/errors: https://paste.tomsmeding.com \| Logs: https://ircbrowse.tomsmeding.com/browse/lchaskell \| AoC 43100-84040706"
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22:32:41	<glguy>	I cleared out a little bit of headroom from people who weren't active this or last year. If you're using Haskell as your main language, feel free to join the AoC leaderboard in the topic
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22:35:51	<sshine>	how do you make AoC interesting this year?
22:36:01	<sshine>	I did some of AoC 2022 in Rust last year.
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22:40:53	<glguy>	The main two things I get from it are the fun of racing for some leaderboard points and then from cleaning things up so that people reading them might learn something about Haskell they didn't know when we're sharing code
22:41:22	<seydar>	glguy: do you post your stuff on the hub of the git
22:41:35	<EvanR>	sshine, solve it in a bespoke programming language, esoteric or optimized for aoc
22:41:40	<glguy>	yeah. traffic was up on the repo before the night even started
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22:42:01	<glguy>	sometimes I'll go and add solutions to my C++ or rust repo if I think there's a fun library or language feature to explore with them
22:42:07	<glguy>	but I do the Haskell one first for completeness
22:42:28	<glguy>	seydar: I put mine on https://github.com/glguy/advent
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23:13:12	<wroathe>	Hey guys, have any of you had any success getting useful statistics out of massif with a Haskell program?
23:13:45	<wroathe>	It seems to just only catch the initial RTS allocation on the main thread and only recognize that for the rest of the program
23:13:58	<wroathe>	threaded or no
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23:19:39	<wroathe>	The situation is that I've got a program that attempts to read N directories full of 4 text files in parallel and each async task processing a directory iterates through the characters of the file and attempts to make some corrections to the contents that it builds up in a ByteString Builder, and then I use the `writeFile` function to try and write the new contents back to the original file. Every time I
23:19:45	<wroathe>	add a new file it seems to increase the total lifetime allocations of my program by like 3GB according to the GHC profiler, but what I really want is to understand how the resident heap size changes over time, and what the peak is
23:20:03	<wroathe>	The text files themselves range from like 2kb to 40MB, so an increase to 3GB of allocations is insane
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23:22:44	<seydar>	I am so close: `liftM read $ sequence [Just '1', Just '2'] :: Maybe Int`
23:23:11	<seydar>	oh wait that worked?
23:23:19	<seydar>	i've been duped by my own lying eyes
23:23:26	<EvanR>	> liftM read $ sequence [Just '1', Just '2'] :: Maybe Int
23:23:27	<lambdabot>	Just 12
23:23:51	<EvanR>	didn't think of that xD
23:24:06	<EvanR>	also
23:24:15	<EvanR>	> read <$> sequence [Just '1', Just '2'] :: Maybe Int
23:24:17	<lambdabot>	Just 12
23:24:52	<seydar>	I couldn't figure out how to use <$> so instead of googling i chose to cry
23:25:11	<ski>	> readMaybe =<< sequence [Just '1',Just '2'] :: Maybe Int
23:25:12	<lambdabot>	Just 12
23:25:33	<ski>	(better to not use `read', unless you're sure there'll be no parse error)
23:26:13	<ski>	(and if you're reading many things in succession, you could try using `reads')
23:26:56	<monochrom>	<$> is infix notation for fmap. Do you know how to use fmap?
23:27:14	<seydar>	monochrom: last year i did, but it's drifting from memory
23:27:21	<EvanR>	liftM = fmap, basically
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23:27:24	<ski>	> replicateM 4 (StateT (reads :: ReadS Int)) `runStateT` "0 12 345 6789"
23:27:26	<lambdabot>	[([0,12,345,6789],"")]
23:27:29	<ski>	> many (StateT (reads :: ReadS Int)) `runStateT` "0 12 345 6789"
23:27:30	<lambdabot>	[([0,12,345,6789],""),([0,12,345]," 6789"),([0,12]," 345 6789"),([0]," 12 34...
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23:28:09	<EvanR>	if you like many ways to do it, liftM = fmap = <$>. If you like there's only one way to do it, there's fmap
23:28:24	<ski>	(then you could, at top-level, filter away solutions that doesn't have empty rest string)
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23:29:28	<seydar>	thanks!
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23:29:58	<ski>	(you can also use list comprehensions, instead of `fmap'/`liftM'/`(<$>)', or `(=<<)'/`concatMap')
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23:52:07	<wroathe>	cabal install eventlog2html... 2 hours later
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23:55:09	<wroathe>	I could kiss mpickering. Finally a heap visualizer that doesn't suck
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All times are in UTC on 2023-12-01.