Logs on 2024-01-30 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 03:23:11 | <tt1231> | For setting up Haskell on Arch Linux, using Code OSS, is using ghcup, and not pacman packages, still the best way to go? I started setting everything up today and I am going to see if I can get everything working tomorrow. |
| 03:23:46 | <geekosaur> | pacman still gets you a mostly broken installation |
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| 03:25:40 | <geekosaur> | if you religiously use `-dynamic` then you can get it to work, but you have to remember to rebuild everything when OS packages get updated |
| 03:26:17 | <geekosaur> | so yes, it's still recommended to use ghcup |
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| 11:59:27 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> hello do we have any 3d game made in haskell? |
| 11:59:46 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> wow today i am eating all the letters |
| 11:59:51 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> *games |
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| 12:15:19 | <cheater> | not that i know of |
| 12:15:32 | <cheater> | you're probably best off trying to integrate with godot |
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| 12:41:36 | <jackdk> | eldritchcookie: https://wiki.haskell.org/Frag |
| 12:43:52 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> yeah it uses opengl |
| 12:44:04 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> so it certainly is possible |
| 12:44:18 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> but i quite prefer cheater's idea |
| 12:44:43 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> godot isn't going away and neither will its c api |
| 12:44:57 | <haskellbridge> | 06<eldritchcookie> though i guess neither will opengl |
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| 13:18:17 | <kaol> | I haven't tried to do anything with it myself but there's https://github.com/typedbyte/hagato at least. |
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| 14:42:23 | <bwe> | what's Haskell's equivalent to Rust's "function xyz not called; consider to remove"? |
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| 14:43:50 | <int-e> | ghc has a -fwarn-unused-binds (also part of -Wall, I think?) |
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| 15:26:32 | <bwe> | int-e: I get only -Wunused-local-binds |
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| 17:44:16 | <bwe> | how can I get those warnings fixed automatically that can be fixed automatically? language server? specific package/tool? |
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| 18:49:28 | <ski> | bwe : hlint warnings ? |
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| 19:13:21 | <bwe> | ski: ghc and hlint warnings |
| 19:13:49 | <bwe> | it's a pity to not have that working out of the box. |
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| 19:23:19 | <monochrom> | Everyone was waiting for everyone else to do it, so no one does it. |
| 19:24:10 | <bwe> | hell, there is half a dozen of auto-fixers. apply-refact for hlint, hlint-plugin recently. it's a fragmented mess. |
| 19:24:19 | <EvanR> | color output for ghci |
| 19:24:27 | <EvanR> | waiting patiently |
| 19:25:23 | <bwe> | I mean, what are the Rust people doing differently so they get the job done? |
| 19:25:57 | <bwe> | is it just we need "donate for idea XYZ" to get it implemented buttons? |
| 19:26:03 | <EvanR> | they have hype |
| 19:26:49 | <bwe> | does hype necessarily gets you the stuff done? |
| 19:27:06 | <EvanR> | hype leads to more people willing to make nice looking css |
| 19:27:15 | <EvanR> | and that leads to the dark side |
| 19:27:18 | <monochrom> | For a group of people who self-identify as believing in open-source, we are exceptional in exhibiting entitlement attitudes. That's the difference. |
| 19:27:36 | <bwe> | EvanR: pls elaborate on the dark side. |
| 19:27:47 | <EvanR> | a bad reference to star wars |
| 19:28:31 | <bwe> | monochrom: So, too many idealists, perfectionists among us leads to not getting anything done. |
| 19:28:31 | <EvanR> | all programming languages with hype come with exuberant community members skilled in the ways of persuasive CSS (not just ability to host pages) |
| 19:28:43 | <EvanR> | regardless of the merits of the language |
| 19:28:49 | <monochrom> | No, entitlement attitude is not perfectionism. |
| 19:28:56 | <bwe> | monochrom: what is it then? |
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| 19:29:10 | <monochrom> | Other communities are like "we're missing X, how can I help?" |
| 19:29:11 | <bwe> | seriously, which auto-fixer can you recommend from your own experience? |
| 19:29:19 | <EvanR> | there's a correlation between massive community contributions and these fancy pages |
| 19:29:49 | <bwe> | monochrom: how are we? |
| 19:29:54 | <monochrom> | This community is like "how the hell are we missing X?! why doesn't someone else do it and gimme?! this is why haskell is not for prime time". |
| 19:30:26 | <bwe> | monochrom: so we are doomed - why are you still here? |
| 19:30:45 | <monochrom> | At least I did my part. I believed that we need a better tutorial on parametric polymorphism. So I wrote it. |
| 19:31:01 | <bwe> | monochrom: link? |
| 19:31:13 | <monochrom> | https://www.vex.net/~trebla/haskell/abs-type-param.html |
| 19:31:34 | <monochrom> | Why shouldn't I be still here? |
| 19:31:50 | <monochrom> | It is not like everyone else's entitlement attitude actually affects me. |
| 19:32:16 | <ski> | bwe : i don't think i'd want that, since hlint can be a bit opinionated, and also sometimes i want to contraindicate, for emphasis |
| 19:32:18 | <monochrom> | And it is not like I'm missing the next fad IDE feature either. |
| 19:32:19 | <bwe> | monochrom: what's the entitlement attitude? can you give me an example? |
| 19:32:34 | <monochrom> | You showed an example. |
| 19:33:17 | <EvanR> | is the next fad ide feature to enforce ormolu everywhere on everything |
| 19:33:29 | <bwe> | there is also formulu |
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| 19:34:03 | <bwe> | monochrom: you mean, complaining and asking for auto-fixer? |
| 19:35:08 | <bwe> | ski: but can we agree on removing unused imports is wanted in each case? ofc that's the ghc auto-fixer. |
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| 19:36:13 | <monochrom> | I don't want that in most cases. |
| 19:36:31 | <monochrom> | Then again, I don't use hlint, I don't use -Wall, so I'm fine. |
| 19:36:38 | <tomsmeding> | no -Wall? |
| 19:36:49 | bwe | is shocked |
| 19:36:54 | <tomsmeding> | do you go warningless or do you have favourites that you turn on manually? |
| 19:36:58 | <monochrom> | I can be talked to using them at finalization time. But that's 1% of the time. |
| 19:37:11 | <monochrom> | s/talked to/talked into/ |
| 19:38:22 | <monochrom> | My code has not been "industry" enough to benefit from warnings. |
| 19:38:52 | <monochrom> | But like I said, for "industry" code, I can be talked into -Wall -Werror at finalization. |
| 19:39:16 | <monochrom> | But also like I said, that means the last mile only. |
| 19:39:18 | <tomsmeding> | I have hate for -Werror, but turn on -Wall always |
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| 19:39:33 | <tomsmeding> | which means I don't _need_ -Werror, because I know when my code has warnings |
| 19:39:37 | <monochrom> | During intermediate drafting stage, the warnings are spurrious and distracting. |
| 19:39:38 | ski | . o O ( "Min-Maxing Your Haskell Imports" in 2019-06-03 at <https://mostlyabsurd.github.io/posts/2019/06/03/minimal-imports-maximal-imports/>,"Min-Maxing Your Haskell Imports (examples)" in 2019-06-09 at <https://mostlyabsurd.github.io/posts/2019/06/09/minimal-imports-maximal-imports-examples/>, both by Robert Djubek ) |
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| 19:39:45 | <tomsmeding> | interesting :) |
| 19:39:53 | <tomsmeding> | I mean, I'm not judging you, I'm assuming you can write good code |
| 19:40:33 | <geekosaur> | I'm wary of -Werror because it tends to mean "don't allow portable code" |
| 19:40:44 | <EvanR> | how so |
| 19:40:56 | <geekosaur> | well, portable across versions |
| 19:41:16 | <EvanR> | because warnings change |
| 19:41:16 | <tomsmeding> | doing -Werror at monochrom's "finalisation time" is fine if you have a development process that doesn't aim at avoiding warnings always |
| 19:41:27 | <tomsmeding> | but don't _release_ code with -Werror because it makes it absolute hell to build for others |
| 19:41:28 | <monochrom> | It is the same principle as how those popup confirmations "are you sure? [Y] [N]" backfired because if you spam it, people become oblivious, it's self-defeating. |
| 19:41:55 | <geekosaur> | because (a) a warning->error might not even exist in an older version (b) sometimes you need considerable histrionics to support multiple ghc versions without tripping warnings |
| 19:42:33 | <geekosaur> | so you find yourself locking out users on Debian or etc. |
| 19:42:44 | × | lockna quits (~lockna@2a01:4f8:10b:14f1::2) (Client Quit) |
| 19:42:46 | <tomsmeding> | maybe this is less of an issue with haskell because one can "just" open the cabal file and remove the -Werror flag if you get issues, but I once had to build some C++ code that used some custom build framework embedded in cmake (!) that re-downloaded source tarballs whenever hashes didn't match |
| 19:43:02 | <monochrom> | In the case of imports, very often I already write like "import Control.Monad(foldM)" in the first place. |
| 19:43:08 | <tomsmeding> | and the downloaded stuff used -Werror and it errored on a harmless (I surely hope) on my machine |
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| 19:43:22 | <tomsmeding> | removing the -Werror meant that the framework would just re-download the source and overwrite my changes |
| 19:43:24 | <tomsmeding> | it was hell |
| 19:43:53 | <monochrom> | Also when it comes to for example Data.Map, the good habit of "import Data.Map qualified ..." already sidesteps the issue altogether. |
| 19:44:22 | tomsmeding | always import Data.Map.Strict (Map) ; import qualified Data.Map.Strict as Map |
| 19:44:31 | <monochrom> | Yeah exactly. |
| 19:45:54 | <tomsmeding> | if I have to work on some code I haven't seen before, and it doesn't have warnings turned on (this holds for Haskell, C and C++, because there I know 1. that warnings are off by default and 2. how to spell the warning flag), the first thing I do is turn on -Wall |
| 19:46:02 | <tomsmeding> | if I then get spammed, I cry |
| 19:46:30 | <tomsmeding> | and I know I'm practically guaranteed to run into bugs that were perfectly indicated by a warning |
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| 19:46:50 | <tomsmeding> | the "practically" in that sentence allows for extraordinary coders |
| 19:47:51 | <monochrom> | If 80% of the warnings point you to bugs, that is worthwhile. But now it means it depends on the code quality in the first place. |
| 19:48:31 | <tomsmeding> | I mean, I'm fine if you go "I use -Wall -Wno-unused-imports" or something |
| 19:49:07 | <tomsmeding> | add your own favourite too-low-signal-to-noise warnings given your coding style |
| 19:49:10 | <monochrom> | I have thought about that. It would mean -Wall <20 -Wno-* here> |
| 19:49:22 | <tomsmeding> | -Wunused-imports is I guess the one with the lowest signal for me |
| 19:49:42 | <tomsmeding> | monochrom: what's the second on the list of -Wno-*? I promise I won't ask for the rest :) |
| 19:50:17 | <monochrom> | -Wno-no-binds. The one about "do { getLine }" for example. |
| 19:50:28 | <monochrom> | I HATE THAT |
| 19:50:39 | <monochrom> | It's hypocrisy. |
| 19:50:44 | × | tri quits (~tri@ool-18bbef1a.static.optonline.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 19:51:22 | <monochrom> | putStrLn "foo" :: IO () is not warned because of the (). |
| 19:52:04 | <tomsmeding> | monochrom: do you mean -Wunused-do-bind? |
| 19:52:04 | <monochrom> | I have "data U = U" and "myfunc :: IO U", and it is warned, even though it is isomorphic to (), even if it is visible in the module. |
| 19:52:38 | <monochrom> | Yeah I don't remember the correct name. (Well, I ended up not turning on any warning anyway, so I don't need to remember anything.) |
| 19:52:39 | <EvanR> | I should set import Data.Map.Strict (Map) ; import qualified Data.Map.Strict as Map as a macro already |
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| 19:53:09 | <tomsmeding> | monochrom: the one where you have a monadic action that returns non-() and you don't bind it to anything but it's not the last line in the block? |
| 19:53:10 | <EvanR> | control b for boilerplate |
| 19:53:12 | <bwe> | I mean, my intention is to have -Wall enabled and solve all issues that come up. So, there is only the option to do it by hand? |
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| 19:53:21 | <monochrom> | Right. |
| 19:53:29 | <tomsmeding> | that's unused-do-bind indeed, and I agree it's low signal-to-noise, but I leave it on anyway |
| 19:53:34 | <tomsmeding> | I like being explicit about not using a result |
| 19:54:01 | <dostoyevsky2> | > def fib = [ 0 -> 1 | 1 -> 1 | N -> fib (N - 2) + fib (N - 1) ] |
| 19:54:03 | <lambdabot> | <hint>:1:9: error: parse error on input ‘=’ |
| 19:54:07 | <monochrom> | I would like that too. But what about my U example? |
| 19:54:10 | <dostoyevsky2> | does Haskell have a syntax that similar to this? |
| 19:54:40 | × | bobby quits (~bob@2a01:799:15e7:a300:a9a7:9c25:284b:6aae) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 19:54:44 | <tomsmeding> | > fib = \case 0 -> 1 ; 1 -> 1 ; n -> fib (n - 2) + fib (n - 1) |
| 19:54:46 | <lambdabot> | <hint>:1:5: error: parse error on input ‘=’ |
| 19:54:46 | <geekosaur> | MultiWayIf? |
| 19:54:49 | <tomsmeding> | % fib = \case 0 -> 1 ; 1 -> 1 ; n -> fib (n - 2) + fib (n - 1) |
| 19:54:49 | <yahb2> | <interactive>:5:8: error: Illegal lambda-case (use LambdaCase) |
| 19:54:54 | <tomsmeding> | % :set -XLambdaCase |
| 19:54:55 | <yahb2> | <no output> |
| 19:54:57 | <tomsmeding> | % fib = \case 0 -> 1 ; 1 -> 1 ; n -> fib (n - 2) + fib (n - 1) |
| 19:54:57 | <yahb2> | <no output> |
| 19:55:00 | <tomsmeding> | % fib 10 |
| 19:55:00 | <yahb2> | 89 |
| 19:55:03 | <monochrom> | I am OK with being forced to write "do { _ <- getLine; ...}". I am not OK with being forced to write "do { _ <- myfunc; ... }". |
| 19:55:03 | <tomsmeding> | https://downloads.haskell.org/ghc/latest/docs/users_guide/exts/lambda_case.html#extension-LambdaCase |
| 19:55:20 | <tomsmeding> | monochrom: I see! I guess I haven't run into that example :) |
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| 19:55:45 | <geekosaur> | hm, guess LambdaCase fits better, yeh |
| 19:55:48 | <tomsmeding> | though I understand, I would feel the same |
| 19:56:23 | <monochrom> | Sometimes my opinion is harder to understand because it is not of the simple form "do X", it is of the compound form "do X1 iff do X2". |
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| 19:57:12 | <tomsmeding> | that's just having a slightly less common coding pattern |
| 19:57:42 | <monochrom> | because every reason for or against X1 also applies to X2, and I am very annoyed when people make excuses to consider them different. |
| 19:58:45 | <tomsmeding> | is it that readers/listeners aren't willing to consider coding styles/situations they themselves don't use / haven't encountered? |
| 19:58:57 | <tomsmeding> | otherwise I'm not sure what your last message was saying |
| 19:59:29 | <monochrom> | Cognitive dissonance. |
| 19:59:49 | <monochrom> | () and U are isomorphic, but people refuse to honour that. |
| 19:59:59 | <monochrom> | So () gets and free pass and U doesn't. |
| 20:00:08 | <monochrom> | s/gets and/gets a/ |
| 20:00:15 | <tomsmeding> | that should just take thinking for a moment about what -Wunused-do-bind is _for_ |
| 20:00:27 | <monochrom> | Yes exactly. |
| 20:00:29 | <tomsmeding> | it's for not ignoring results that you may have forgotten to use |
| 20:00:41 | <tomsmeding> | if there is no information in a particular result, there is nothing to forget to use |
| 20:01:01 | <monochrom> | There is no information in a U result. |
| 20:01:07 | <tomsmeding> | I guess it's just uncommon to have a data type that's isomorphic to () :p |
| 20:01:18 | <tomsmeding> | ("why not just use ()?") |
| 20:01:23 | × | dhruvasagar quits (~dhruvasag@49.207.206.234) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 20:01:47 | <beogrif> | I _guess_ you could check it's not bottom but that'd be rare |
| 20:02:04 | <tomsmeding> | sure -- but that would apply to () as well |
| 20:02:19 | <monochrom> | One can also check for ()'s bottom with "() <- putStrLn foo". |
| 20:02:25 | <tomsmeding> | and I would happy write off putting information in non-bottomness as an anti-pattern |
| 20:02:28 | <tomsmeding> | *happily |
| 20:02:45 | <monochrom> | See? Everything you say about (), I can say about U too. They are isomorphic. |
| 20:02:54 | <tomsmeding> | I'm not disagreeing :p |
| 20:03:10 | × | SAJAT quits (~sajat@84-236-3-92.pool.digikabel.hu) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 20:03:12 | <beogrif> | tomsmeding, yeah definitely |
| 20:03:19 | <EvanR> | () has 2 connected components and U has only 1! |
| 20:03:29 | <tomsmeding> | monochrom: surely almost everyone you give this example to must have asked you "why do you not just use ()" |
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| 20:03:43 | <tomsmeding> | which _in itself_ is an admission that they're isomorphic |
| 20:03:55 | <tomsmeding> | ignoring topological properties of their typical rendering in computer typefaces |
| 20:04:01 | tomsmeding | glances at EvanR |
| 20:04:20 | <monochrom> | I don't have an answer for that. But I don't need to, in the context where I say what's wrong with that warning and why it is a bug. |
| 20:04:38 | × | eggplantade quits (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6917:2efe:dcc7:7830) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 20:04:42 | ski | idly ponders singletons, and GADTs in general |
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| 20:04:46 | <tomsmeding> | have you actually been in this situation? |
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| 20:05:09 | <EvanR> | all singletons are isomorphic |
| 20:05:17 | <EvanR> | type level programming is a sham |
| 20:05:20 | <beogrif> | oh yeah, singletons |
| 20:05:50 | <monochrom> | I think I once had some experimental code that for some reason I preferred my own unit type and got bitten. |
| 20:05:51 | <beogrif> | it's hard to go back from dependent typing to not, though I haven't been driven to using singletons yet |
| 20:06:00 | <tomsmeding> | I would consider the constructor of a single-constructor-without-fields singleton to not be isomorphic to () for the purposes of this warning: there is information in it |
| 20:06:04 | <monochrom> | I grant you that it happened only once. |
| 20:06:18 | <tomsmeding> | monochrom: then you have the right to complain :) |
| 20:06:41 | <tomsmeding> | beogrif: you can also do your dependent typing in haskell and have the worst of both worlds! |
| 20:06:47 | <tomsmeding> | singletons galore |
| 20:07:01 | <beogrif> | I'm holding out for DH if possible |
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| 20:08:09 | <EvanR> | 0 carries no information. 1 carries no information. mysteriously, a stream of 0s and 1s may carry information. find the cheat |
| 20:08:42 | ski | points to the exformation |
| 20:08:50 | <monochrom> | No no no, EvanR. 0 carries infinite information! That's the real surprise and bugger. :) |
| 20:08:54 | <tomsmeding> | a stream of (0 or 1)s carries information |
| 20:08:59 | <beogrif> | yeah bits are 1 + 1 |
| 20:09:06 | <tomsmeding> | a stream of 0s and 1s does not :) |
| 20:09:14 | <beogrif> | 1 + 0 would mean you can't construct zero bits at all or whatever |
| 20:09:33 | <EvanR> | exformation? |
| 20:09:43 | <monochrom> | hahaha this plays into "or" vs "and" |
| 20:09:46 | <beogrif> | you have to think outside the box |
| 20:10:08 | <ski> | the surrounding context that allows you to interpret data as information meaningfully |
| 20:10:13 | <beogrif> | Exformation is related to https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/extropy |
| 20:10:25 | <monochrom> | Natural language's "stream of 0s and 1s" is a sloppy way to say "(the stream contains 0) and (the stream contains 1)" |
| 20:10:32 | <beogrif> | oh it's actually a thing nvm |
| 20:10:42 | <ski> | e.g. ribosomes, in relation to DNA and RNA |
| 20:10:49 | <tomsmeding> | i.e. the cheat was that the language was deceptively ambiguous :) |
| 20:11:10 | <EvanR> | information is more than the sum of its parts |
| 20:11:26 | <EvanR> | sum type of its parts |
| 20:11:29 | <ski> | or, a pre-arranged agreement that ringing six signals, then hanging up, means something in particular |
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| 20:12:09 | × | sudden quits (~cat@user/sudden) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 20:12:20 | <EvanR> | ah yeah, like, if you get a letter with 1000 zeros, or don't get anything by the deadline, that means something |
| 20:12:56 | × | dhruvasagar quits (~dhruvasag@49.207.206.234) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 20:13:03 | <ski> | information in `A + B' comes from not knowing, a priori, whether you've actually got an `A', or a `B' (and then the information contained in that alternative itself) |
| 20:13:09 | <monochrom> | I don't see how transhumanism has to do with needing context/protocol to interpret bit streams. :) |
| 20:14:47 | <ski> | (so, you could say it's the inclusions which add that bit of information) |
| 20:15:36 | <beogrif> | yeah, particularly since in type theory you can't "distinguish the inhabitants" of two types without functions/inclusions, unlike might be presumed in a set theory |
| 20:16:10 | <ski> | @where boolean-blindness |
| 20:16:11 | <lambdabot> | http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2011/03/15/boolean-blindness/ |
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| 20:17:24 | <beogrif> | heh |
| 20:17:54 | <beogrif> | what about () blindness :o |
| 20:18:40 | <EvanR> | two inhabitants, () and undefined xD |
| 20:18:54 | <beogrif> | hilarious |
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| 20:18:55 | <ski> | Sierpinski is a weird type |
| 20:19:20 | <ski> | @where topology |
| 20:19:20 | <lambdabot> | "topology in Haskell" <http://www.haskell.org/pipermail/haskell/2004-June/014134.html> and "Synthetic topology of data types and classical spaces" <http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~mhe/papers/entcs87.(pdf| |
| 20:19:21 | <lambdabot> | dvi|ps)> by Mart�n Escard� |
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| 20:19:50 | <beogrif> | topology of logic stuff is still so weird but it's getting more intuitive |
| 20:20:11 | <beogrif> | I guess learning more homotopy type theory helped |
| 20:20:14 | ski | thinks lambdabot has started cutting up responses into shorter fragments, semi-recently .. |
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| 20:26:37 | <tomsmeding> | also some encoding went wrong there |
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| 20:27:16 | <tomsmeding> | (it came in as a unicode replacement character here) |
| 20:27:19 | <beogrif> | same |
| 20:27:39 | <geekosaur> | I got ó |
| 20:27:47 | <tomsmeding> | it's probably latin-1 |
| 20:27:47 | <geekosaur> | suspect it's ISO8859-1 |
| 20:27:50 | <tomsmeding> | that |
| 20:28:02 | tomsmeding | cannot remember that number |
| 20:28:11 | <EvanR> | Martín Escardó |
| 20:28:20 | × | peterbecich quits (~Thunderbi@047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 20:28:41 | <tomsmeding> | @where+ topology "topology in Haskell" <http://www.haskell.org/pipermail/haskell/2004-June/014134.html> and "Synthetic topology of data types and classical spaces" <http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~mhe/papers/entcs87.(pdf|dvi|ps)> by Martín Escardó |
| 20:28:42 | <lambdabot> | Done. |
| 20:28:46 | <tomsmeding> | @where topology |
| 20:28:46 | <lambdabot> | "topology in Haskell" <http://www.haskell.org/pipermail/haskell/2004-June/014134.html> and "Synthetic topology of data types and classical spaces" <http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~mhe/papers/entcs87.(pdf| |
| 20:28:46 | <lambdabot> | dvi|ps)> by Martín Escardó |
| 20:28:48 | <tomsmeding> | there. |
| 20:29:19 | ski | sees no difference, in Irssi |
| 20:29:43 | <tomsmeding> | irssi and whatever geekosaur is using probably render non-utf8 bytes as iso-8859-1 |
| 20:29:45 | <EvanR> | I imagine people still fixing stuff like that in 2124 |
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| 20:29:59 | <geekosaur> | hexchat uses iso8859-1 aas fallback by default |
| 20:30:16 | <ski> | makes sense |
| 20:30:19 | <Rembane> | My irssi gives a difference. It's prettier now. No odd question mark characters. |
| 20:30:20 | <tomsmeding> | weechat just U+FFFDs it |
| 20:30:20 | <EvanR> | I'm using hexchat... but I got question marks |
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| 20:30:42 | <tomsmeding> | ( https://tomsmeding.com/unicode#U+FFFD ) |
| 20:30:43 | <geekosaur> | there's a settings checkbox for the fallback behavior iirc |
| 20:30:52 | <monochrom> | I explicit told my hexchat to dishonour ISO-8859-1. |
| 20:31:00 | <monochrom> | ISO-8859-1 die die die. |
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| 20:31:57 | <EvanR> | codepage 437 is superior |
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| 23:52:57 | ← | iakov parts (~quassel@2a02:8106:244:b000:c4b2:cd08:c7cf:1672) (https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) |
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All times are in UTC on 2024-01-30.