Home liberachat/#haskell: Logs Calendar

Logs on 2024-02-01 (liberachat/#haskell)

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08:40:37 <haskellbridge> 10<m​aralorn> Ah, that’s a good point.
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09:13:19 <cheater> what do you call this technique? you look at a code base, and look at a value somewhere within that code base. say return foo. you copy "return foo" to a new text file. then in the code base you go up, possibly through function calls, and look at what was assigned to foo. that's an expression that contains some other variables. so you look up those variables as well. you keep going until you hit well known library functions, or user input. you end up
09:13:19 <cheater> with one giant expression, or possibly a couple big ones, e.g. if expression1 is used a few times in expression2 (it makes more sense to do things like that for readability). you simplify the code as much as you can and, where functions are called, you get rid of arguments that don't do anything important (like eg arguments set to reasonable defaults, paths to config files, etc). you get rid of trivial functions like eg converting a Text to ByteString
09:13:19 <cheater> or converting a Float to Double, fromEnum, and the likes, to simplify the code to the absolute gist of it.
09:13:52 <cheater> i call it "reverse evaluation", but maybe someone has seen it somewhere else.
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09:32:14 <kuribas> cheater: inlining?
09:32:43 <kuribas> well, inlining and partial evaluation.
09:32:52 <kuribas> Maybe reduction to normal form.
09:32:57 <cheater> it's not really inlining, because yeah
09:33:21 <cheater> normal form implies an AST-style data structure and there being a normal form
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09:34:32 <kuribas> well, depends on your definition of normal form :)
09:34:48 <kuribas> You can also evaluate known functions and known variables.
09:35:48 <lortabac> it's a form of partial evaluation
09:36:22 <lortabac> there is something called "constant folding" which is related to what you are describing
09:38:14 <lortabac> but more generally I would just say "partial evaluation"
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09:41:03 <cheater> what do you call it when you have a sentence written in denotational semantics, and you have a "tower of interpreters" or "tower of compilers", each of which denotates a new level of semantics for the same universal statement, and you take your original sentence, and you lift/drop it across that tower?
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09:46:35 <cheater> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denotational_semantics#Denotational_semantics_as_source-to-source_translation
09:46:42 <cheater> "denotational translation"?
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09:53:31 <cheater> it's also not decomplecting
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10:21:53 <cheater> "derecursion"?
10:22:04 <cheater> "full resolution"?
10:22:25 <cheater> "full dereferencing"?
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11:14:47 <cheater> mmmmh
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13:58:50 <tomsmeding> cheater: yeah for your first question: first extraction (factoring out, perhaps) and then partial evaluation
13:59:10 <tomsmeding> partial evaluation includes both inlining definitions and specialising those definitions to the actual arguments being supplied, keeping some abstract/symbolic
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14:20:19 <danse-nr3> huh... a clue about a lens that changes the last element of a list please? I grew some ... worry about directly approaching Lens' doc
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14:21:50 <ncf> :t _last
14:21:51 <lambdabot> (Snoc s s a a, Applicative f) => (a -> f a) -> s -> f s
14:22:20 <danse-nr3> cool i am good with the final answer. Cheers
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15:13:02 <cheater> tomsmeding: right... but that doesn't include the elision of superfluous details
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15:25:26 <tomsmeding> cheater: fair, but that kind of elision is dangerous in any case, because you can only really determine what's superfluous once you understand the code :p
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15:25:59 <tomsmeding> what if some later expansion uncovers some ad-hoc polymorphism on a type distinction that you considered superfluous
15:26:18 <cheater> typeshit doesn't have ad-hoc polymorphism
15:26:21 <cheater> sorry typescript
15:26:43 <tomsmeding> nice typo
15:26:50 <cheater> it never was
15:27:01 <tomsmeding> but I see
15:27:14 <tomsmeding> (makes sense given the compilation target and compilation method)
15:27:43 <tomsmeding> okay I have a name for you
15:27:54 <tomsmeding> "fuck your abstraction, what does it do"
15:28:36 <cheater> how about "first-principle derivation"
15:29:10 <cheater> the final formula for foo is a "first-principle derivation" of foo
15:34:02 <haskellbridge> 06<s​m> concretising ? deabstracting ? instantiating ?
15:35:25 <sorrowbird> wow this channel truly is interesting just like the lanagugage xD
15:35:33 <sorrowbird> hello people of the internet
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15:37:28 <haskellbridge> 06<s​m> hello sorrowbird
15:38:19 <haskellbridge> 06<s​m> concretising ? deabstracting ? instantiating ? applying ?
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16:25:38 <haskellbridge> 15<J​ade> hiya
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17:34:40 <trnry> So I've been away from Haskell for a number of years, and now I'm struggling to compile something I used to do all the time. I used to always copy the source for reflex-gloss when I needed to make a visualization tool and build off of it. But what is basically the hello world of what I am doing is failing to build when I turn on GHC2021 instead of Haskell2010. I have narrowed the offending
17:34:42 <trnry> extension down to PolyKinds. I don't think I know anything about kind polymorphism, so could someone help me understand why this breaks when PolyKinds is on?
17:34:50 <trnry> This is my file: https://paste.debian.net/1306028/
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17:35:00 <trnry> And this is the error: https://paste.debian.net/1306029/
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17:46:33 <EvanR> trnry, your handleTrigger helper function in the where clause might need a type signature if it would refer to type variables
17:46:36 <EvanR> just a guess
17:47:44 <EvanR> another way to bumble ahead is to break out your functions into dedicated top level functions (with extra params for the closed over variables) and make sure they type check
17:48:33 <EvanR> just putting a type signature on `network' might also help the error message
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18:02:31 <[Leary]> trnry: I'm not 100%, but I think the issue is that the polymorphism for the type `t` and it's kind `k1` are divorced. Due to the polymorphic `network` argument, the implementor of `playReflex` gets to choose any convenient `t` ... or so you would, but you're blocked by the fact that the /caller/ of `playReflex` chooses `k1`.
18:03:28 <[Leary]> Try changing the type of the argument to `(forall k (t :: k) m. GlossApp t m)`.
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19:50:16 <trnry> [Leary]: That did it, thanks a bunch
19:50:38 <trnry> I'm surprised at how much I feel like I don't know what I'm doing now that it's been a couple years
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19:56:10 <[Leary]> Blame implicit binders. If you /had/ to bind `k` explicitly, you probably would have done so in the right place.
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All times are in UTC on 2024-02-01.