Logs on 2024-04-11 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 03:51:27 | <jcarpenter2> | jle`: ah thanks for the resource! i had already arrived at their `applyExpr` function, looks like this post describes the direction I'm trying to go |
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| 04:25:26 | <fut> | #h |
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| 09:03:02 | ← | L29Ah parts (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) () |
| 09:04:00 | <dminuoso> | https://gist.github.com/dminuoso/640518c49bdd41f426ad0566bf088cb5 |
| 09:04:25 | <dminuoso> | Is there any way to make GHC emit just more information here? That huge stack of generics is forcing that constraint somewhere, but I have absolutely no clue where. |
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| 11:25:05 | × | jleightcap quits (7bc4014b62@user/jleightcap) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:05 | × | whereiseveryone quits (206ba86c98@2a03:6000:1812:100::2e4) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:05 | × | b0o quits (0e4a0bf4c9@2a03:6000:1812:100::1bf) (Write error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:25:05 | × | shreyasminocha quits (51fdc93eda@user/shreyasminocha) (Write error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:25:05 | × | ggb quits (a62ffbaf4f@2a03:6000:1812:100::3ac) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:05 | × | cpli quits (77fc530071@2a03:6000:1812:100::252) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:25:05 | × | ymherklotz quits (cb2c9cfbdd@2a03:6000:1812:100::29a) (Write error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:25:05 | × | fgaz_ quits (1ff9197ed6@2a03:6000:1812:100::11ea) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:05 | × | chaitlatte0 quits (ea29c0bb16@user/chaitlatte0) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:05 | × | fluffyballoon quits (45ce440a48@2a03:6000:1812:100::e2) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:06 | × | bsima1 quits (9d7e39c8ad@2a03:6000:1812:100::dd) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:06 | × | fvr quits (ef3e56ca8b@2a03:6000:1812:100::3c4) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:06 | × | fn_lumi quits (3d621153a5@2a03:6000:1812:100::df7) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:06 | × | lukec quits (9dfd4d094e@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:06 | × | filwisher quits (2e6936c793@2a03:6000:1812:100::170) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:06 | × | arcadewise quits (52968ed80d@2a03:6000:1812:100::3df) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:14 | → | bsima1 joins (9d7e39c8ad@2a03:6000:1812:100::dd) |
| 11:25:15 | → | pmk joins (6afe4476a1@2a03:6000:1812:100::26d) |
| 11:25:15 | → | sus joins (1b7af6299f@user/zeromomentum) |
| 11:25:16 | → | probie joins (cc0b34050a@user/probie) |
| 11:25:16 | × | Miroboru quits (~myrvoll@178-164-114.82.3p.ntebredband.no) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:25:16 | → | eso joins (a0662dfd5e@2a03:6000:1812:100::1266) |
| 11:25:17 | → | jmcantrell joins (644f1bed9a@user/jmcantrell) |
| 11:25:17 | → | ggb joins (a62ffbaf4f@2a03:6000:1812:100::3ac) |
| 11:25:17 | → | lukec joins (9dfd4d094e@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e) |
| 11:25:17 | → | raghavgururajan joins (ea769b8000@user/raghavgururajan) |
| 11:25:17 | → | filwisher joins (2e6936c793@2a03:6000:1812:100::170) |
| 11:25:17 | → | jkoshy joins (99b9359beb@user/jkoshy) |
| 11:25:17 | → | lane joins (809450f172@2a03:6000:1812:100::1300) |
| 11:25:17 | → | henrytill joins (e0180937c3@2a03:6000:1812:100::e8c) |
| 11:25:18 | → | aniketd joins (32aa4844cd@2a03:6000:1812:100::dcb) |
| 11:25:18 | → | arcadewise joins (52968ed80d@2a03:6000:1812:100::3df) |
| 11:25:18 | → | fgaz_ joins (1ff9197ed6@2a03:6000:1812:100::11ea) |
| 11:25:19 | → | rselim joins (ce261f06ff@user/milesrout) |
| 11:25:19 | → | akspecs joins (00cc8321af@sourcehut/user/akspecs) |
| 11:25:19 | → | evanrelf joins (3addc196af@2a03:6000:1812:100::f0) |
| 11:25:21 | → | Ankhers joins (e99e97ef8e@2a03:6000:1812:100::2a2) |
| 11:25:21 | → | samhh joins (7569f027cf@2a03:6000:1812:100::e4) |
| 11:25:22 | → | ursa-major joins (114efe6c39@2a03:6000:1812:100::11f3) |
| 11:25:22 | → | brettgilio joins (a35ba67324@2a03:6000:1812:100::260) |
| 11:25:22 | → | jleightcap joins (7bc4014b62@user/jleightcap) |
| 11:25:22 | → | whereiseveryone joins (206ba86c98@2a03:6000:1812:100::2e4) |
| 11:25:23 | → | jakzale joins (6291399afa@user/jakzale) |
| 11:25:25 | → | duncan joins (c6181279e3@user/meow/duncan) |
| 11:25:26 | → | fn_lumi joins (3d621153a5@2a03:6000:1812:100::df7) |
| 11:25:26 | → | fluffyballoon joins (45ce440a48@2a03:6000:1812:100::e2) |
| 11:25:27 | → | b0o joins (0e4a0bf4c9@2a03:6000:1812:100::1bf) |
| 11:25:27 | → | kuruczgy joins (55b66dd3ae@2a03:6000:1812:100::127f) |
| 11:25:27 | → | ymherklotz joins (cb2c9cfbdd@2a03:6000:1812:100::29a) |
| 11:25:28 | → | dxld joins (a6d27c8ee6@2a03:6000:1812:100::52) |
| 11:25:30 | × | haskellbridge quits (~haskellbr@069-135-003-034.biz.spectrum.com) (Excess Flood) |
| 11:25:30 | → | JoelMcCracken joins (5ea8252fbb@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e3) |
| 11:25:30 | → | shreyasminocha joins (51fdc93eda@user/shreyasminocha) |
| 11:25:31 | → | sm2n joins (ae95cb1267@user/sm2n) |
| 11:25:31 | → | chaitlatte0 joins (ea29c0bb16@user/chaitlatte0) |
| 11:25:31 | → | fvr joins (ef3e56ca8b@2a03:6000:1812:100::3c4) |
| 11:25:33 | → | cpli joins (77fc530071@2a03:6000:1812:100::252) |
| 11:25:44 | → | Square joins (~Square4@user/square) |
| 11:25:49 | × | duncan quits (c6181279e3@user/meow/duncan) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:50 | × | b0o quits (0e4a0bf4c9@2a03:6000:1812:100::1bf) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:51 | × | eso quits (a0662dfd5e@2a03:6000:1812:100::1266) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:52 | × | probie quits (cc0b34050a@user/probie) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:53 | × | JoelMcCracken quits (5ea8252fbb@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e3) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:53 | × | arcadewise quits (52968ed80d@2a03:6000:1812:100::3df) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:53 | × | brettgilio quits (a35ba67324@2a03:6000:1812:100::260) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:53 | × | jkoshy quits (99b9359beb@user/jkoshy) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:53 | × | raghavgururajan quits (ea769b8000@user/raghavgururajan) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:53 | × | pmk quits (6afe4476a1@2a03:6000:1812:100::26d) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:25:57 | × | ursa-major quits (114efe6c39@2a03:6000:1812:100::11f3) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | jleightcap quits (7bc4014b62@user/jleightcap) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | cpli quits (77fc530071@2a03:6000:1812:100::252) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | fvr quits (ef3e56ca8b@2a03:6000:1812:100::3c4) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | henrytill quits (e0180937c3@2a03:6000:1812:100::e8c) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | fgaz_ quits (1ff9197ed6@2a03:6000:1812:100::11ea) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | aniketd quits (32aa4844cd@2a03:6000:1812:100::dcb) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | whereiseveryone quits (206ba86c98@2a03:6000:1812:100::2e4) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:26:22 | × | sm2n quits (ae95cb1267@user/sm2n) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | bsima1 quits (9d7e39c8ad@2a03:6000:1812:100::dd) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | lukec quits (9dfd4d094e@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | akspecs quits (00cc8321af@sourcehut/user/akspecs) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | ggb quits (a62ffbaf4f@2a03:6000:1812:100::3ac) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | rselim quits (ce261f06ff@user/milesrout) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | Ankhers quits (e99e97ef8e@2a03:6000:1812:100::2a2) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | samhh quits (7569f027cf@2a03:6000:1812:100::e4) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | shreyasminocha quits (51fdc93eda@user/shreyasminocha) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | jmcantrell quits (644f1bed9a@user/jmcantrell) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | filwisher quits (2e6936c793@2a03:6000:1812:100::170) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | chaitlatte0 quits (ea29c0bb16@user/chaitlatte0) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | lane quits (809450f172@2a03:6000:1812:100::1300) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | evanrelf quits (3addc196af@2a03:6000:1812:100::f0) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | dxld quits (a6d27c8ee6@2a03:6000:1812:100::52) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:22 | × | sus quits (1b7af6299f@user/zeromomentum) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:23 | × | fn_lumi quits (3d621153a5@2a03:6000:1812:100::df7) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:23 | × | fluffyballoon quits (45ce440a48@2a03:6000:1812:100::e2) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:23 | × | jakzale quits (6291399afa@user/jakzale) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:25 | × | ymherklotz quits (cb2c9cfbdd@2a03:6000:1812:100::29a) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:26:25 | × | kuruczgy quits (55b66dd3ae@2a03:6000:1812:100::127f) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:28:08 | → | bsima1 joins (9d7e39c8ad@2a03:6000:1812:100::dd) |
| 11:28:08 | → | lukec joins (9dfd4d094e@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e) |
| 11:28:09 | → | filwisher joins (2e6936c793@2a03:6000:1812:100::170) |
| 11:28:09 | → | lane joins (809450f172@2a03:6000:1812:100::1300) |
| 11:28:10 | → | ggb joins (a62ffbaf4f@2a03:6000:1812:100::3ac) |
| 11:28:10 | → | raghavgururajan joins (ea769b8000@user/raghavgururajan) |
| 11:28:10 | → | eso joins (a0662dfd5e@2a03:6000:1812:100::1266) |
| 11:28:10 | → | fgaz_ joins (1ff9197ed6@2a03:6000:1812:100::11ea) |
| 11:28:11 | → | pmk joins (6afe4476a1@2a03:6000:1812:100::26d) |
| 11:28:11 | → | evanrelf joins (3addc196af@2a03:6000:1812:100::f0) |
| 11:28:11 | → | fluffyballoon joins (45ce440a48@2a03:6000:1812:100::e2) |
| 11:28:11 | → | probie joins (cc0b34050a@user/probie) |
| 11:28:11 | → | fn_lumi joins (3d621153a5@2a03:6000:1812:100::df7) |
| 11:28:11 | → | arcadewise joins (52968ed80d@2a03:6000:1812:100::3df) |
| 11:28:12 | → | aniketd joins (32aa4844cd@2a03:6000:1812:100::dcb) |
| 11:28:13 | → | kuruczgy joins (55b66dd3ae@2a03:6000:1812:100::127f) |
| 11:28:13 | → | Ankhers joins (e99e97ef8e@2a03:6000:1812:100::2a2) |
| 11:28:14 | → | JoelMcCracken joins (5ea8252fbb@2a03:6000:1812:100::10e3) |
| 11:28:14 | → | whereiseveryone joins (206ba86c98@2a03:6000:1812:100::2e4) |
| 11:28:14 | → | jmcantrell joins (644f1bed9a@user/jmcantrell) |
| 11:28:15 | → | brettgilio joins (a35ba67324@2a03:6000:1812:100::260) |
| 11:28:15 | → | akspecs joins (00cc8321af@2a03:6000:1812:100::11a) |
| 11:28:15 | → | shreyasminocha joins (51fdc93eda@user/shreyasminocha) |
| 11:28:15 | → | ursa-major joins (114efe6c39@2a03:6000:1812:100::11f3) |
| 11:28:16 | × | akspecs quits (00cc8321af@2a03:6000:1812:100::11a) (Changing host) |
| 11:28:16 | → | akspecs joins (00cc8321af@sourcehut/user/akspecs) |
| 11:28:17 | → | samhh joins (7569f027cf@2a03:6000:1812:100::e4) |
| 11:28:17 | → | b0o joins (0e4a0bf4c9@2a03:6000:1812:100::1bf) |
| 11:28:18 | → | duncan joins (c6181279e3@user/meow/duncan) |
| 11:28:19 | → | ymherklotz joins (cb2c9cfbdd@2a03:6000:1812:100::29a) |
| 11:28:19 | → | sm2n joins (ae95cb1267@user/sm2n) |
| 11:28:19 | → | sus joins (1b7af6299f@user/zeromomentum) |
| 11:28:21 | → | fvr joins (ef3e56ca8b@2a03:6000:1812:100::3c4) |
| 11:28:21 | → | dxld joins (a6d27c8ee6@2a03:6000:1812:100::52) |
| 11:28:21 | → | rselim joins (ce261f06ff@user/milesrout) |
| 11:28:21 | → | cpli joins (77fc530071@2a03:6000:1812:100::252) |
| 11:28:21 | → | chaitlatte0 joins (ea29c0bb16@user/chaitlatte0) |
| 11:28:21 | → | jleightcap joins (7bc4014b62@user/jleightcap) |
| 11:28:21 | → | jakzale joins (6291399afa@user/jakzale) |
| 11:28:22 | → | henrytill joins (e0180937c3@2a03:6000:1812:100::e8c) |
| 11:28:23 | → | jkoshy joins (99b9359beb@user/jkoshy) |
| 11:29:23 | → | samhh_ joins (7569f027cf@2a03:6000:1812:100::e4) |
| 11:37:13 | × | Fijxu_ quits (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) (Quit: XD!!) |
| 11:38:18 | → | yin joins (~yin@user/zero) |
| 11:38:42 | → | darkstardevx joins (~darkstard@50.53.3.2) |
| 11:39:00 | → | Fijxu joins (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) |
| 11:41:27 | × | darkstardevx quits (~darkstard@50.53.3.2) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:41:50 | × | chiselfuse quits (~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 11:42:43 | × | yin quits (~yin@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 11:43:37 | → | yin joins (~yin@user/zero) |
| 11:44:07 | → | chiselfuse joins (~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse) |
| 11:47:54 | × | stiell_ quits (~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 11:48:39 | × | yin quits (~yin@user/zero) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:50:59 | × | xff0x quits (~xff0x@125x103x176x34.ap125.ftth.ucom.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 11:51:03 | → | stiell_ joins (~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) |
| 11:56:08 | × | madeleine-sydney quits (~madeleine@user/madeleine-sydney) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 12:02:51 | × | ddellacosta quits (~ddellacos@ool-44c73d29.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 12:04:00 | → | yin joins (~yin@user/zero) |
| 12:09:36 | → | L29Ah joins (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) |
| 12:13:26 | → | billchenchina joins (~billchenc@2a0d:2580:ff0c:1:e3c9:c52b:a429:5bfe) |
| 12:21:13 | × | danse-nr3 quits (~danse-nr3@an-19-178-47.service.infuturo.it) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 12:24:35 | × | hippoid quits (~hippoid@user/hippoid) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 12:25:15 | → | hippoid joins (~hippoid@c-98-213-162-40.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 12:31:29 | → | waleee joins (~waleee@h-176-10-144-38.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 12:32:31 | × | yin quits (~yin@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 12:33:44 | → | yin joins (~yin@user/zero) |
| 12:41:42 | → | raehik joins (~raehik@rdng-25-b2-v4wan-169990-cust1344.vm39.cable.virginm.net) |
| 12:42:09 | → | yeitrafferin joins (~user@2a04:4540:720b:b700:fa81:ac57:de72:bade) |
| 12:43:21 | → | danse-nr3 joins (~danse-nr3@151.37.238.5) |
| 12:43:46 | × | danse-nr3 quits (~danse-nr3@151.37.238.5) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 12:44:10 | → | danse-nr3 joins (~danse-nr3@151.37.238.5) |
| 12:52:03 | × | tinjamin quits (~tinjamin@banshee.h4x0r.space) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat) |
| 12:54:16 | → | tinjamin joins (~tinjamin@banshee.h4x0r.space) |
| 12:56:55 | × | euleritian quits (~euleritia@ip4d16fc38.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 13:10:21 | → | euleritian joins (~euleritia@dynamic-176-006-187-251.176.6.pool.telefonica.de) |
| 13:14:49 | × | cfricke quits (~cfricke@user/cfricke) (Quit: WeeChat 4.2.2) |
| 13:18:50 | → | simendsjo joins (~user@84.209.170.3) |
| 13:27:11 | × | incertia quits (~incertia@209.122.137.252) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 13:39:24 | × | bitdex quits (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Quit: = "") |
| 13:41:54 | → | Sgeo joins (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
| 13:48:28 | × | ezzieyguywuf quits (~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 13:48:35 | × | euleritian quits (~euleritia@dynamic-176-006-187-251.176.6.pool.telefonica.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 13:48:52 | → | euleritian joins (~euleritia@ip4d16fc38.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) |
| 13:53:41 | × | yin quits (~yin@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 13:55:36 | → | yin joins (~yin@user/zero) |
| 13:57:54 | × | euleritian quits (~euleritia@ip4d16fc38.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 13:58:54 | → | euleritian joins (~euleritia@dynamic-176-006-187-251.176.6.pool.telefonica.de) |
| 14:00:17 | → | xff0x joins (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:665a:484:4391:cc83) |
| 14:05:27 | × | sp1ff` quits (~user@c-24-21-45-157.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 14:11:42 | × | yin quits (~yin@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 14:12:32 | → | tri joins (~tri@ool-18bbef1a.static.optonline.net) |
| 14:13:24 | → | yin joins (~yin@user/zero) |
| 14:17:23 | × | tri quits (~tri@ool-18bbef1a.static.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 14:20:23 | × | doyougnu- quits (~doyougnu@045-046-170-068.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 14:21:30 | × | mei quits (~mei@user/mei) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 14:22:13 | → | mei joins (~mei@user/mei) |
| 14:25:55 | → | tri joins (~tri@ool-18bbef1a.static.optonline.net) |
| 14:26:57 | × | danse-nr3 quits (~danse-nr3@151.37.238.5) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 14:28:35 | → | danse-nr3 joins (~danse-nr3@151.37.238.5) |
| 14:30:57 | × | tri quits (~tri@ool-18bbef1a.static.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 14:31:41 | × | waleee quits (~waleee@h-176-10-144-38.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 14:35:03 | → | zetef joins (~quassel@5.2.182.99) |
| 14:39:03 | × | zer0bitz quits (~zer0bitz@user/zer0bitz) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 14:43:22 | × | tromp quits (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 14:46:17 | × | n8n quits (n8n@user/n8n) (Quit: WeeChat 4.2.2) |
| 14:56:22 | → | n8n joins (n8n@user/n8n) |
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| 15:04:54 | <lyxia> | dminuoso: maybe the secret -ddump-cs-trace helps? I once learned about it here (but never got the opportunity to use it since) https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/issues/15044 |
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| 16:39:35 | <cheater> | @hoogle [a] -> a -> [[a]] |
| 16:39:36 | <lambdabot> | Happstack.Server.Internal.MessageWrap splitList :: Eq a => a -> [a] -> [[a]] |
| 16:39:36 | <lambdabot> | Data.GI.CodeGen.Util splitOn :: Eq a => a -> [a] -> [[a]] |
| 16:39:36 | <lambdabot> | Hledger.Utils splitAtElement :: Eq a => a -> [a] -> [[a]] |
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| 16:44:31 | <EvanR> | Data.List.Split has splitOn :: Eq a => [a] -> [a] -> [[a]] |
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| 17:07:55 | <cheater> | hmm oh |
| 17:08:06 | <cheater> | yeah it's weird that this function doesn't exist in stdlib |
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| 17:14:14 | <geekosaur> | there is no stdlib in that sense |
| 17:15:02 | <geekosaur> | this isn't python, and the tight binding between base and ghc means we want to avoid putting too many things into base that thereby become frozen / non-upgradeable without upgrading ghc |
| 17:17:49 | <sm> | I consider `split` part of the stdlib |
| 17:18:17 | <sm> | (safe, also) |
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| 17:27:48 | <probie> | :t \p -> unfoldr (\x -> let x' = dropWhile p x in if null x' then Nothing else Just (break p x')) |
| 17:27:49 | <lambdabot> | (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> [[a]] |
| 17:31:17 | <probie> | How often do you really use `splitOn` on anything other than `Text` (which comes with its own `splitOn`)? |
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| 17:50:07 | <akegalj> | probie: I use splitOn constantly on small programming contents |
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| 17:50:52 | <c_wraith> | and in general, String hate has gone way too far. There are a lot of programs where it's just fine and there's no reason to touch Text |
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| 17:52:56 | <akegalj> | s/contents/contests |
| 17:53:06 | <geekosaur> | afaict 90% of strings used in xmonad are so short that Text would cause a space blowup |
| 17:53:27 | <geekosaur> | window titles are the only place where they'd be a win |
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| 17:56:18 | <c_wraith> | unfoldr, though. I utterly hate the nested data in it. And yeah, I know GHC is likely to optimize out all the Just constructors, but it still hurts me to see them there. |
| 17:57:30 | <c_wraith> | Every time I see it, I just want to twist the type around into (forall r. b -> r -> (a -> b -> r) -> r) -> b -> [a] |
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| 18:00:50 | <ncf> | say no! to church encodings |
| 18:00:52 | <c_wraith> | What do you even call that? like... I guess it's a CPS transform on the function argument, but not the whole definition? |
| 18:01:38 | <ncf> | you've just replaced Maybe with its church encoding |
| 18:01:51 | <c_wraith> | Well. I've replaced Maybe (a, b) with its church encoding. |
| 18:01:57 | <c_wraith> | which makes it pay off a lot more |
| 18:02:45 | <c_wraith> | also, it's not like this is a case where the data will be re-used, which is when church encoding gets bad for performance. |
| 18:07:42 | ski | 'd still want unboxed sum types |
| 18:07:52 | <ski> | (unboxing the continuations, not the values) |
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| 18:14:26 | <sm> | c_wraith hear hear |
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| 18:17:10 | <dolio> | You should fix your heuristics to not 'hurt' you by applying them in (likely) inappropriate contexts. |
| 18:17:33 | <c_wraith> | that's why I want -ffull-laziness off by default. :P |
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| 18:27:25 | <nij-> | Is it possible to do RPC in haskell? If so, how does haskell guarantee that the return value will be of certain type? |
| 18:28:00 | <nij-> | It doesn't have to be RPC; any procedure that refers to the external of haskell should have this problem. |
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| 18:28:28 | <c_wraith> | The general solution is to parse received according to rules for the type |
| 18:28:45 | <c_wraith> | You don't just slam it into memory blindly, you ensure that it's correct. |
| 18:28:45 | <nij-> | What is the type of PARSE then? |
| 18:28:58 | <nij-> | Its "input type" has to be those too.. |
| 18:29:27 | <c_wraith> | It'd be something like Binary a => ByteString -> a |
| 18:29:41 | <c_wraith> | well. Binary a => ByteString -> Either ParseError a |
| 18:29:57 | <nij-> | Oh! |
| 18:30:28 | <c_wraith> | Maybe you'd use a different class than Binary. |
| 18:30:34 | <c_wraith> | But that's the basic shape. |
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| 18:31:12 | <nij-> | I see! Thanks! |
| 18:32:23 | <c_wraith> | There's a project called "cloud haskell" that is endeavoring to build a platform sort of like Erlang/OTP. I think. I haven't checked in on it in a while. It may have stalled out. |
| 18:32:45 | <nij-> | cool |
| 18:34:44 | <geekosaur> | it's distributed-process now, and seems to still be getting commits |
| 18:35:07 | <geekosaur> | (I thought it was yet another promising project that died when its author got hired into industry…) |
| 18:35:45 | <nij-> | Does the author still haskell? |
| 18:37:31 | <geekosaur> | mm, website hasn't been updated since 2017 😞 |
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| 18:38:00 | <nij-> | When I was working in a company, the most time were spent on killing bugs. |
| 18:38:39 | <nij-> | Some of them are type related (i.e. could have been prevented by a strong type system), and while some of them are logical mistake (e.g. wrting +1 instead of -1). |
| 18:39:16 | <nij-> | I wonder when you're coding in haskell in a relatively large codebase, do you still encounter a lot of bugs? And if so, are most ofthem of the second type? |
| 18:40:05 | <geekosaur> | seems like something to ask of ghc, pandoc, etc. devs |
| 18:40:42 | <nij-> | Are they here? |
| 18:40:58 | <c_wraith> | Having done it... Haskell isn't magic. Bugs are still bugs, though there are classes of bugs that just go away. I just spent 2 days tracking down an issue in rails caused by accidentally mutating a global variable. That wouldn't happen in Haskell, but it's not related to types. :) |
| 18:41:40 | <nij-> | oh yeah global var is evil too.. though handy |
| 18:41:54 | <c_wraith> | The big wins you get from types in Haskell projects is the ability to make changes with a lot of touch points relatively fearlessly. |
| 18:42:06 | <nij-> | How does haskellers "live without" global vars though? given that they are so handy? |
| 18:42:46 | <c_wraith> | It wasn't uncommon for someone to go "this design is suboptimal" in our haskell product, then... change it. touch a lot of lines in a lot of files, and it all still works the same way when it type checks again. |
| 18:42:49 | <nij-> | When I'm lisping I try to keep global vars out. But there are scenarios where introducing global vars make the program much less verbose. |
| 18:42:54 | <geekosaur> | they're usually a mistake even in non-haskell, in my experience |
| 18:43:33 | <nij-> | And global vars usually are helpful if I'm writing a "stateful machine" or a "stateful procedure". |
| 18:43:39 | <nij-> | I wonder how haskellers would do that. |
| 18:43:54 | <nij-> | For example, I was asked by my boss to write a chatbot, using their "technology". |
| 18:44:04 | <nij-> | or say their "algorithm" |
| 18:44:13 | <nij-> | But their algorithm isn't a composition of several clean little functions |
| 18:44:28 | <nij-> | Instead, in its nature, it has to do step A, B, C,.. etc Z. |
| 18:44:39 | <nij-> | But in step ,say, F, you need to use the result from A and B. |
| 18:44:55 | <nij-> | So simply put, say there are ten steps A1, A2, .., A10. |
| 18:45:11 | <nij-> | To perform A(k+1), you basically need to results from A1,..,Ak. |
| 18:45:15 | <nij-> | Thus the "state". |
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| 18:45:33 | <nij-> | The action of A(k+1) is going to depend on them. You can't just simply through them away. |
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| 18:46:00 | <c_wraith> | There are a lot of patterns for local or scoped state that are often used. |
| 18:46:40 | <c_wraith> | They get names like the State transformer, or RIO. |
| 18:47:06 | <nij-> | Does it just accumulate the state as it passes? |
| 18:47:33 | <nij-> | So instead of PossibleOutComeType(i)->PossibleOutComeType(i+1). |
| 18:47:35 | <c_wraith> | That's what the State transformer does. It just handles the bookkeeping of passing it all around correctly in complex control flow. |
| 18:47:52 | <nij-> | Make all functions to be of type Possible(1)+Possible(2)+..POssible(n) -> Possible(1)+Possible(2)+..POssible(n) ? |
| 18:48:24 | <c_wraith> | that sounds more like indexed types. They can add safety, but be really awkward to work with. |
| 18:49:07 | <nij-> | Oh no no sorry lemme rephrase |
| 18:49:29 | <nij-> | (I'm not good at haskell so maybe I use terms wrong..) |
| 18:49:40 | <nij-> | (Union A B C D E .. Z) -> (Union A B C D E .. Z) |
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| 18:58:14 | <danse-nr3> | Union A B -> Union C D |
| 18:58:35 | <danse-nr3> | given A -> C, B -> D? |
| 18:58:57 | <nij-> | No, given A->B AB->C, ABC->D, ABCD->E |
| 18:59:23 | <danse-nr3> | interesting |
| 18:59:46 | <nij-> | Some algorithms are in this nature, and it was quite painful to write. |
| 18:59:57 | <nij-> | I imagine it would be even more painful in haskell.. right? |
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| 19:00:02 | <ncf> | no |
| 19:00:10 | <nij-> | How would you approach it? |
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| 19:02:34 | <ncf> | f :: A → B, g :: (A, B) → C, h :: (A, B, C) → D ⊢ (λ a → h (a, f a, g (a, f a))) :: A → D |
| 19:02:44 | <ncf> | (forgive me for stopping at 3) |
| 19:03:13 | <ncf> | then use let bindings for sharing and deduplication, and then maybe move into your favourite monad |
| 19:03:28 | <danse-nr3> | or not XD |
| 19:03:40 | <danse-nr3> | (the monad step) |
| 19:04:06 | <ncf> | it's fine if your favourite monad is the identity monad |
| 19:04:26 | <nij-> | I don't know how this could be wrapped into a monad. |
| 19:04:27 | <danse-nr3> | what is that, modus ponens? |
| 19:04:43 | <danse-nr3> | don't think about that part nij- |
| 19:05:03 | <nij-> | Why not? |
| 19:05:14 | <ncf> | do b ← f a; c ← g a b; d ← h a b c; ... |
| 19:05:18 | <danse-nr3> | to make your life easier to start with |
| 19:05:21 | <nij-> | A monad is just an monoid in the algebra End(F), where F is a functor. |
| 19:05:35 | <ncf> | almost |
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| 19:11:52 | <ski> | (.. kinda looks like course-of-values induction) |
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| 19:42:52 | <jle`> | jcarpenter2: np! goes to show, a lot of times when you think you need make a monad, you really don't :) |
| 19:43:30 | <jle`> | to be fair sometimes you really do want to make a monad |
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| 19:44:13 | <danse-nr3> | (: |
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| 20:10:49 | <EvanR> | when you wish upon a monad |
| 20:11:09 | <geekosaur> | …it will bind your soul |
| 20:13:26 | <Rembane> | It's simply too powerful! |
| 20:17:12 | <EvanR> | there's some kind of hierarchy of power where Functor is less powerful than Applicative is less powerful than Monad. If the details of what this power is or isn't could be fleshed out maybe that could open up more kinds of abstractions so you get the right kind of power? Or proves these are the only essentially unique possibilities |
| 20:19:13 | <c_wraith> | Applicative is a weird place on that hierarchy. |
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| 20:20:34 | <c_wraith> | Going from Functor to Monad can be done minimally (at least in theory; the classes don't support this) by providing return and join. |
| 20:21:08 | <c_wraith> | the combination of return and join can't be used to recover fmap, so they imply something new. |
| 20:22:13 | <c_wraith> | But Applicative is weird. Functor to Applicative requires adding pure and <*>, which.. can be combined to give you back fmap. |
| 20:22:36 | <c_wraith> | There's redundancy there, in a strange way. |
| 20:23:30 | <Rembane> | c_wraith: Speaking of which. Have you seen the Purescript type class hierarchy? |
| 20:23:39 | <c_wraith> | meanwhile, going from Applicative to Monad doesn't seem possible with something smaller than join. The added power <*> gives you doesn't help. |
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| 20:24:57 | <c_wraith> | It feels like the segmentation between them is... not ideal, in some sense. You'd want to break things down differently, if there was some obvious way to do so. |
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| 20:25:03 | <c_wraith> | Rembane: I haven't |
| 20:25:59 | <probie> | Split Applicative into Pointed and Apply(? I forget the canonical name for Applicative without `pure`) |
| 20:27:20 | <EvanR> | uh isn't what you're describing "solved" by removing return from Monad... at least in the haskellworld |
| 20:27:26 | <Rembane> | c_wraith: They have split the Functor, Applicative, Monad trio into more typeclasses that in some ways make more sense. |
| 20:27:35 | <EvanR> | requiring pure and return to be the same thing |
| 20:30:04 | <c_wraith> | EvanR: no. That turns out to be completely irrelevant to my actual observations. 1. It's weird that pure + <*> gives you everything in Functor. There's no "smaller" implementation of Applicative that re-uses some of Functor. 2. It's weird that there's no smaller implementation of Monad that needs a less powerful tool to get from pure and <*> than join. |
| 20:30:31 | <c_wraith> | In both cases, it's kind of an observation that <*> is the weird thing. |
| 20:31:12 | <EvanR> | I tried to understand what you're saying but failed. There's nothing between Applicative and Monad. Sounds plausible, and interesting |
| 20:33:01 | <ncf> | sure there is |
| 20:33:46 | <dolio> | It's not smaller, but I think you can make an equivalent version of Applicative that requires fmap to recover the current interface. |
| 20:33:47 | <ncf> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/invertible-0.2.0.8/docs/Control-Invertible-Monoidal.html#t:Monoidal |
| 20:34:38 | <ncf> | i guess i don't understand the observation either |
| 20:34:40 | <EvanR> | is that equivalent to Applicative |
| 20:34:50 | <ncf> | but there's nothing weird mathematically here |
| 20:34:52 | <EvanR> | rather than strictly between |
| 20:35:39 | <c_wraith> | Nah, that actually is better, from this point of view. You can't recover fmap from that, but when given fmap you get something fully equivalent to Applicative |
| 20:36:04 | <EvanR> | Functor is a prerequisite there |
| 20:36:23 | <monochrom> | There is Arrow between Applicative and Monad. :) |
| 20:36:45 | <ncf> | you can't state the Monoidal laws without fmap |
| 20:37:37 | <c_wraith> | the key feature remains: unit and >*< can't recover fmap. |
| 20:37:57 | <c_wraith> | The operations are smaller than those of Applicative |
| 20:37:59 | <EvanR> | Arrow, a new abstract view of computation |
| 20:38:09 | <ncf> | i don't know why that's a feature |
| 20:38:09 | <EvanR> | by John Hughes |
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| 23:14:25 | <jackdk> | monochrom: how is Arrow "between" Applicative and Monad when the kinds are different? |
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| 23:33:35 | <monochrom> | Short answer: If T is a Monad, then K a b = a -> T b makes K an Arrow. If K is an arrow, then K () is an Applicative (IIRC). |
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| 23:35:18 | <monochrom> | Long answer: https://homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/wadler/topics/monads.html#arrows-and-idioms |
| 23:35:45 | <jackdk> | Thanks |
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