Logs on 2025-04-05 (liberachat/#haskell)
| 00:06:42 | Feuermagier | is now known as Guest6426 |
| 00:06:42 | → | Feuermagier_ joins (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) |
| 00:06:42 | × | Guest6426 quits (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Killed (tungsten.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) |
| 00:06:42 | Feuermagier_ | is now known as Feuermagier |
| 00:06:54 | × | otto_s quits (~user@p5de2ff42.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 00:08:29 | → | otto_s joins (~user@p5de2f9f0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 00:08:41 | × | jacopovalanzano quits (~jacopoval@cpc151911-cove17-2-0-cust105.3-1.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 00:14:57 | × | krei-se quits (~krei-se@p200300f1cfff3299da9ef3fffe7fdac8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 00:16:37 | → | krei-se joins (~krei-se@p3ee0f069.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 00:19:27 | → | inca joins (~inca@syn-098-011-170-006.res.spectrum.com) |
| 00:24:46 | × | notdabs quits (~Owner@2600:1700:69cf:9000:c0fa:b50a:3031:4dce) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 00:25:13 | × | inca quits (~inca@syn-098-011-170-006.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 00:25:57 | × | acidjnk_new3 quits (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f05ad6cd39b235d43c6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 00:41:48 | × | Feuermagier quits (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 00:44:11 | → | remexre joins (~remexre@user/remexre) |
| 00:46:45 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 00:57:52 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 01:03:02 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 01:05:35 | × | cheater quits (~Username@user/cheater) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 01:13:38 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 01:18:06 | → | pavonia joins (~user@user/siracusa) |
| 01:22:27 | × | Square2 quits (~Square@user/square) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 01:33:44 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> cheating feels good, or rather, being able to improve the algorithm slightly with replacement of quot (foo 3) bar /= quot (foo 4) bar with a slightly more efficient algorithm, although I guess I should track down Gordon to confirm that Debian benchmarks told us to screw ourselves :( |
| 01:38:01 | <haskellbridge> | <thirdofmay18081814goya> anyone know if "ghc-lib-parser" provides a monad to construct "Settings" and "DynFlags"? |
| 01:38:16 | <haskellbridge> | <thirdofmay18081814goya> from the local ghc environment |
| 01:40:03 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> lol it's ironic because Jeremy Gibbons published the original algorithm that pidigits is supposed to be based on |
| 01:40:06 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> https://www.cs.ox.ac.uk/people/jeremy.gibbons/publications/spigot.pdf |
| 01:40:10 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> that's the spec, hahahaha |
| 01:43:21 | <haskellbridge> | <thirdofmay18081814goya> you can use "getSessionDynFlags" supposing "GhcMonad" |
| 01:57:56 | → | Feuermagier joins (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) |
| 01:58:32 | × | tabemann quits (~tabemann@2600:1700:7990:24e0:eb48:5118:6a44:9814) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 01:58:35 | → | thuna` joins (~thuna`@user/thuna/x-1480069) |
| 01:58:56 | → | tabemann joins (~tabemann@2600:1700:7990:24e0:abb4:3ad0:1d9:d299) |
| 02:05:41 | × | toby-bro quits (~toby-bro@user/toby-bro) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 02:06:13 | <haskellbridge> | <thirdofmay18081814goya> hm but "GhcMonad" needs the "ghc-lib" package which is sort of huge |
| 02:06:42 | <haskellbridge> | <thirdofmay18081814goya> any other method to construct "Settings" and "DynFlags", other than manually filling out the fields? |
| 02:08:42 | × | forell quits (~forell@user/forell) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 02:09:00 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> thirdofmay18081814goya: you're also on matrix, you can try the matrix haskell channel as well |
| 02:09:49 | <haskellbridge> | <thirdofmay18081814goya> will ask there too ty |
| 02:10:29 | → | cheater joins (~Username@user/cheater) |
| 02:16:55 | <monochrom> | It should be pretty evident by now that even though converting (mod 7) to a faster multiplication and bitwise operations is well understood, it is not going to be a priority of GHC for the forseeable future. Instead, let use -fllvm and let LLVM do it. |
| 02:18:18 | <monochrom> | Applying very basic economics, you look at what reward people get for contributing to GHC, you see their priorities. |
| 02:19:20 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 02:19:31 | <monochrom> | So for example, some people get papers published for adding linear types to GHC, so they did. But no one gets papers published for using linear types to optimize code, so no one does. |
| 02:20:15 | <monochrom> | Not to mention the too-little-too-late :doc commands. |
| 02:22:20 | → | gabiruh_ joins (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) |
| 02:23:56 | × | gabiruh quits (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 02:27:59 | × | ZLima12 quits (~zlima12@user/meow/ZLima12) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 02:29:08 | → | ZLima12 joins (~zlima12@user/meow/ZLima12) |
| 02:31:01 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 02:35:49 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 02:46:48 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 02:51:59 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 02:53:47 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 02:58:34 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 03:00:24 | × | tessier quits (~tessier@ec2-184-72-149-67.compute-1.amazonaws.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 03:01:28 | × | tremon quits (~tremon@83.80.159.219) (Quit: getting boxed in) |
| 03:02:29 | → | tessier joins (~tessier@ip68-8-117-219.sd.sd.cox.net) |
| 03:03:40 | × | chiselfuse quits (~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 03:04:14 | → | chiselfuse joins (~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse) |
| 03:09:41 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 03:10:02 | × | monochrom quits (trebla@216.138.220.146) (Quit: ZNC 1.9.1+deb1 - https://znc.in) |
| 03:14:48 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 03:24:56 | → | monochrom joins (trebla@216.138.220.146) |
| 03:25:28 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 03:35:14 | × | tabaqui quits (~tabaqui@167.71.80.236) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 03:51:21 | × | krei-se quits (~krei-se@p3ee0f069.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 03:52:29 | → | krei-se joins (~krei-se@p200300f1cfff387fda9ef3fffe7fdac8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 03:58:45 | → | JuanDaugherty joins (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) |
| 04:04:08 | × | tessier quits (~tessier@ip68-8-117-219.sd.sd.cox.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 04:05:16 | → | peterbecich joins (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) |
| 04:05:29 | → | tessier joins (~tessier@ec2-184-72-149-67.compute-1.amazonaws.com) |
| 04:10:44 | → | takuan joins (~takuan@d8D86B601.access.telenet.be) |
| 04:12:17 | × | rvalue quits (~rvalue@user/rvalue) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 04:12:49 | → | rvalue joins (~rvalue@user/rvalue) |
| 04:13:06 | × | Fijxu quits (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) (Quit: XD!!) |
| 04:14:50 | × | califax quits (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 04:15:05 | → | califax joins (~califax@user/califx) |
| 04:15:50 | → | Fijxu joins (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) |
| 04:30:36 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 04:41:48 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 04:46:43 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 04:57:54 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 04:59:11 | → | Unicorn_Princess joins (~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) |
| 05:01:00 | Pixi` | is now known as Pixi |
| 05:03:32 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 05:04:30 | × | nitrix quits (~nitrix@user/meow/nitrix) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 05:10:07 | × | peterbecich quits (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 05:13:41 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 05:19:32 | → | peterbecich joins (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) |
| 05:20:02 | → | harveypwca joins (~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:f6e0:27d6:8cc7:eca9:c46c) |
| 05:23:12 | × | jmcantrell quits (~weechat@user/jmcantrell) (Quit: WeeChat 4.6.0) |
| 05:23:12 | jmcantrell_ | is now known as jmcantrell |
| 05:33:18 | × | remexre quits (~remexre@user/remexre) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 05:34:30 | → | remexre joins (~remexre@user/remexre) |
| 05:40:41 | × | aman quits (~aman@user/aman) (Quit: aman) |
| 05:42:06 | × | Eoco quits (~ian@128.101.131.218) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 05:44:12 | → | Eoco joins (~ian@128.101.131.218) |
| 05:59:10 | → | nitrix joins (~nitrix@user/meow/nitrix) |
| 06:00:04 | × | peterbecich quits (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 06:07:32 | × | cyphase quits (~cyphase@user/cyphase) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 06:18:49 | → | tavare joins (~tavare@user/tavare) |
| 06:18:52 | → | dhil joins (~dhil@2a0c:b381:52e:3600:3a06:d959:ac54:37fc) |
| 06:19:00 | × | tavare quits (~tavare@user/tavare) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 06:25:58 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 06:37:40 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 06:44:03 | × | dhil quits (~dhil@2a0c:b381:52e:3600:3a06:d959:ac54:37fc) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 07:00:03 | × | caconym quits (~caconym@user/caconym) (Quit: bye) |
| 07:00:49 | → | JamesMowery17 joins (~JamesMowe@ip68-228-212-232.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 07:00:51 | → | caconym joins (~caconym@user/caconym) |
| 07:17:11 | → | Lord_of_Life_ joins (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) |
| 07:18:09 | × | Lord_of_Life quits (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 07:18:33 | Lord_of_Life_ | is now known as Lord_of_Life |
| 07:23:28 | → | Feuermagier_ joins (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) |
| 07:23:28 | × | Feuermagier quits (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Killed (tantalum.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) |
| 07:23:28 | Feuermagier_ | is now known as Feuermagier |
| 07:30:12 | × | Feuermagier quits (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 07:32:18 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 07:45:04 | → | acidjnk_new3 joins (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f09082661686fc91abe.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 07:46:56 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 07:58:22 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 08:14:05 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:80ac:965e:288a:e7e3) |
| 08:36:36 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 08:36:37 | × | acidjnk_new3 quits (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f09082661686fc91abe.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 08:37:16 | × | harveypwca quits (~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:f6e0:27d6:8cc7:eca9:c46c) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 08:41:51 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 08:48:37 | → | lxsameer joins (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) |
| 08:48:41 | → | j1n37 joins (~j1n37@user/j1n37) |
| 08:49:56 | × | j1n37- quits (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 08:54:33 | × | smalltalkman quits (uid545680@id-545680.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 08:54:45 | → | smalltalkman joins (uid545680@id-545680.hampstead.irccloud.com) |
| 08:54:58 | × | tomku quits (~tomku@user/tomku) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 08:55:15 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 08:55:15 | → | tomku joins (~tomku@user/tomku) |
| 08:55:24 | × | roconnor quits (~quassel@rocq/roconnor) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 08:55:24 | × | haveo_ quits (~weechat@pacamara.iuwt.fr) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 08:55:35 | × | mud quits (~mud@user/kadoban) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 08:55:49 | → | haveo joins (~weechat@pacamara.iuwt.fr) |
| 08:55:58 | → | roconnor joins (~quassel@rocq/roconnor) |
| 08:56:01 | → | mud joins (~mud@user/kadoban) |
| 09:00:01 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 09:00:14 | → | __monty__ joins (~toonn@user/toonn) |
| 09:05:36 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 09:10:21 | → | acidjnk_new3 joins (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f092d86e29bd2672a66.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 09:11:05 | × | tzh quits (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
| 09:14:34 | → | Tuplanolla joins (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 09:15:18 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 09:16:30 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 09:21:13 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 09:28:14 | × | JuanDaugherty quits (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) (Quit: praxis.meansofproduction.biz (juan@acm.org)) |
| 09:29:40 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> hmmm, curious, has anyone reported issues with ccall ffi? |
| 09:30:04 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> https://benchmarksgame-team.pages.debian.net/benchmarksgame/program/pidigits-ghc-5.html |
| 09:30:24 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> performance here has completely collapsed since a couple of recent benchmarking exercises, probably because of a change in ccal ffi |
| 09:30:41 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> I swapped it to Capi, and performance is back, currently about... |
| 09:30:56 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> 110% of C |
| 09:32:16 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 09:41:39 | × | koz quits (~koz@121.99.240.58) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 09:46:50 | → | koz joins (~koz@121.99.240.58) |
| 09:53:24 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> in terms of time |
| 09:56:11 | × | acidjnk_new3 quits (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f092d86e29bd2672a66.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 09:59:22 | → | Digitteknohippie joins (~user@user/digit) |
| 10:00:36 | × | Digit quits (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 10:05:14 | → | wootehfoot joins (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) |
| 10:14:08 | × | Digitteknohippie quits (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 10:14:54 | × | thuna` quits (~thuna`@user/thuna/x-1480069) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 10:16:45 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 10:23:25 | → | cyphase joins (~cyphase@user/cyphase) |
| 10:24:14 | <__monty__> | Bigger is better, so beating C already, nice : D |
| 10:27:15 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> I think they meant 110% time, so 90% performance? |
| 10:27:20 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> Or smth like that |
| 10:28:19 | → | tremon joins (~tremon@83.80.159.219) |
| 10:32:00 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> yeah |
| 10:32:28 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> now i'm trying to figure out why, in haskell, using divMod is an optimization, but in C, using tdiv_qr is not |
| 10:32:46 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> because even with tdiv_qr on a junk variable, it's still increasing times by 30% |
| 10:34:57 | <__monty__> | Probably Haskell's div is just `fst . divMod` while in C the backing algorithm somehow shortcuts not needing an accurate remainder or the other way around, whatever. |
| 10:35:21 | <__monty__> | (I was joking about the bigger is better, FYI.) |
| 10:38:09 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> this is really, really weird, because the C isn't that much faster, 315 ms vs 430-480 ms on haskell |
| 10:39:58 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 10:47:43 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) |
| 10:49:05 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> i guess the real question is, why is Haskell efficient on bigint if it's using gmp as a backend, but gmp itself isn't? |
| 10:50:34 | → | digitteknohippie joins (~user@user/digit) |
| 10:51:45 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 10:52:39 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 10:53:01 | digitteknohippie | is now known as Digit |
| 10:56:56 | <haskellbridge> | <Morj> There are a lot of ways to use gmp. There are several rust wrappers around it, and the performance can differ 5 times |
| 10:57:22 | <haskellbridge> | <Morj> I haven't dug deeper yet, even when making this rust thing go faster is literally my day job >_> |
| 10:58:43 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 10:59:56 | × | Sgeo quits (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 11:00:04 | × | caconym quits (~caconym@user/caconym) (Quit: bye) |
| 11:01:50 | → | internatetional joins (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:73ee:b330:880d:2daa) |
| 11:02:18 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 11:02:22 | → | caconym joins (~caconym@user/caconym) |
| 11:02:24 | × | Unicorn_Princess quits (~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 11:04:02 | × | lxsameer quits (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 11:13:34 | × | ftzm quits (~ftzm@085080243028.dynamic.telenor.dk) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat) |
| 11:14:51 | × | ljdarj quits (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Quit: ljdarj) |
| 11:16:24 | → | target_i joins (~target_i@user/target-i/x-6023099) |
| 11:17:57 | × | internatetional quits (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:73ee:b330:880d:2daa) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 11:18:04 | → | internatetional_ joins (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:2654:9c7d:282c:a56a) |
| 11:21:20 | → | internatetional joins (~nate@2400:9800:320:db5f:1:0:1913:8d11) |
| 11:23:13 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 11:23:54 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:80ac:965e:288a:e7e3) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 11:24:51 | × | internatetional_ quits (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:2654:9c7d:282c:a56a) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 11:25:29 | → | forell joins (~forell@user/forell) |
| 11:26:54 | × | vanishingideal quits (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 11:28:15 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 11:28:44 | → | vanishingideal joins (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) |
| 11:29:12 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 11:36:17 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 11:43:23 | <Angelz> | hi lambdabot. |
| 11:45:03 | Angelz | is now known as gadot |
| 11:52:37 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) |
| 11:53:25 | × | vanishingideal quits (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 11:55:38 | → | acidjnk_new3 joins (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f09a45abb10e29fc466.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:59:09 | → | rit joins (~rit@2409:40e0:1c:121c:8974:a096:1a7b:cd3b) |
| 11:59:44 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 12:11:08 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 12:22:31 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 12:27:01 | × | rit quits (~rit@2409:40e0:1c:121c:8974:a096:1a7b:cd3b) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 12:32:02 | × | hiecaq quits (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) (Quit: ERC 5.6.0.30.1 (IRC client for GNU Emacs 30.0.92)) |
| 12:33:13 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 12:33:41 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:80ac:965e:288a:e7e3) |
| 12:36:02 | → | rit joins (~rit@2409:40e0:1c:121c:8974:a096:1a7b:cd3b) |
| 12:36:51 | → | hiecaq joins (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) |
| 12:40:17 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 12:41:57 | × | acidjnk_new3 quits (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f09a45abb10e29fc466.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 12:44:59 | → | Square2 joins (~Square@user/square) |
| 12:45:25 | → | lxsameer joins (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) |
| 12:47:21 | ← | L29Ah parts (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) () |
| 12:48:14 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 12:51:13 | × | internatetional quits (~nate@2400:9800:320:db5f:1:0:1913:8d11) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 12:51:49 | → | Digitteknohippie joins (~user@user/digit) |
| 12:53:22 | → | acidjnk_new3 joins (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f09a46d68cf1a287932.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 12:53:24 | × | Digit quits (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 13:01:51 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 13:11:44 | × | cheater quits (~Username@user/cheater) (Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)) |
| 13:13:12 | → | cheater joins (~Username@user/cheater) |
| 13:13:26 | × | cheater quits (~Username@user/cheater) (Client Quit) |
| 13:16:39 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 13:16:40 | → | cheater joins (~Username@user/cheater) |
| 13:17:24 | × | cheater quits (~Username@user/cheater) (Client Quit) |
| 13:19:18 | × | rit quits (~rit@2409:40e0:1c:121c:8974:a096:1a7b:cd3b) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 13:21:45 | → | internatetional joins (~nate@2400:9800:322:960e:1:0:1981:db59) |
| 13:26:17 | → | rit joins (~rit@2409:40e0:1c:121c:8974:a096:1a7b:cd3b) |
| 13:28:43 | × | acidjnk_new3 quits (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f09a46d68cf1a287932.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 13:36:13 | → | notdabs joins (~Owner@2600:1700:69cf:9000:58e6:6428:d346:1de6) |
| 13:39:33 | × | lxsameer quits (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 13:43:25 | → | toby-bro joins (~toby-bro@user/toby-bro) |
| 13:43:45 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 13:48:39 | × | Flow quits (~none@gentoo/developer/flow) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 13:48:56 | → | cheater joins (~Username@user/cheater) |
| 13:51:12 | × | internatetional quits (~nate@2400:9800:322:960e:1:0:1981:db59) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 13:55:58 | → | statusbot10 joins (~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com) |
| 13:56:12 | × | statusbot quits (~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 13:56:25 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 13:56:49 | Digitteknohippie | is now known as Digit |
| 13:58:11 | → | jespada joins (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 14:01:00 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 14:01:34 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:80ac:965e:288a:e7e3) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 14:04:39 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:80ac:965e:288a:e7e3) |
| 14:09:28 | → | internatetional joins (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:de63:cea6:2301:accc) |
| 14:22:35 | → | inca joins (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) |
| 14:27:54 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 14:30:40 | × | emmanuelux quits (~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 14:32:38 | → | L29Ah joins (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) |
| 14:42:46 | × | jespada quits (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 14:43:01 | <hellwolf> | hlint suggested me to use mapAndUnzipM. I had never known it existed. And why would there be a specialized function for such a thing.. |
| 14:43:18 | <hellwolf> | Per base code: "mapAndUnzipM f xs = unzip <$> traverse f xs" |
| 14:47:46 | → | jespada joins (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 14:48:15 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:80ac:965e:288a:e7e3) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 14:50:08 | → | internatetional_ joins (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:605b:9669:a8fc:b9c5) |
| 14:53:32 | <tomsmeding> | why can ghc not "just" understand that pattern matching interacts with apartness |
| 14:53:43 | × | internatetional quits (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:de63:cea6:2301:accc) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 14:54:18 | <hellwolf> | hmm? |
| 14:55:11 | <tomsmeding> | which GHC developer should I pay to have GHC accept this code https://play.haskell.org/saved/HYLMVGG5 |
| 14:55:29 | <tomsmeding> | the fact that the pattern match on SA failed _means_ that `tag` is not A |
| 14:55:47 | <tomsmeding> | yes this involves inspecting the GADT for certain properties that make this work |
| 14:55:51 | <tomsmeding> | no I don't care, I want this |
| 14:55:52 | <merijn> | tomsmeding: I don't see GADTs enabled? |
| 14:56:17 | <tomsmeding> | merijn: implied by TypeFamilies |
| 14:56:30 | <tomsmeding> | it doesn't |
| 14:56:51 | <tomsmeding> | I dunno, but GHC's behaviour doesn't change if I enable GADTs |
| 14:58:40 | <ski> | i wonder whether you could do that, with polymorphic variants, and GADTs, in OCaml .. |
| 14:59:06 | <ski> | (.. i'd suspect GADTs there only apply to the regular variants, though) |
| 14:59:28 | <tomsmeding> | now I have to write stupid stuff like this https://paste.tomsmeding.com/2iMHvceB |
| 15:05:13 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) |
| 15:08:15 | <hellwolf> | I guess you need to provide some injectivity proof. However, your Split cannot be injective by the current typefamilydependencies rules. |
| 15:10:02 | <tomsmeding> | yes, it's not quite injectivity, it's more subtle |
| 15:11:31 | <tomsmeding> | I guess the logic could be: all tag constructors that only appear in GADT constructors that you've already fully pattern-matched away, are apart from the tag in the thing you're now matching |
| 15:11:37 | <tomsmeding> | this would be sufficient for me |
| 15:11:48 | <tomsmeding> | and I guess this should apply to every type parameter of the GADT individually |
| 15:14:13 | × | euphores quits (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 15:17:11 | <hellwolf> | have you tried FunDep? I think TF and FunDep has a few places that don't share the same capability |
| 15:17:29 | <hellwolf> | let me give it a quick try |
| 15:21:47 | × | inca quits (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 15:23:49 | <hellwolf> | nope. I can't make any sort of overlapping to work so far: |
| 15:23:49 | <hellwolf> | class Fam (tag :: Tag) (t :: Type) | tag -> t where |
| 15:23:49 | <hellwolf> | instance {-# OVERLAPPABLE #-} Fam a Bool where |
| 15:23:49 | <hellwolf> | instance {-# OVERLAPPING #-} Fam A Int where |
| 15:26:17 | <hellwolf> | it's sort of inference that obvious to our intuition, but hard to convince the computer until we can articulate it precisely what that intuition is... |
| 15:27:08 | <hellwolf> | it is about injectivity, but we don't seem to have enough expressiveness in the language here |
| 15:27:22 | sintheta | is now known as src |
| 15:27:55 | <tomsmeding> | hellwolf: I think the fundamental issue here is that while a pattern match success does produce type equalities, pattern match failure does not produce type inequalities |
| 15:27:57 | <tomsmeding> | ever |
| 15:28:10 | <tomsmeding> | and in general, it can't! But here it can and I want it to |
| 15:28:30 | <tomsmeding> | type inequalities are also probably much harder to reason about in an inference engine |
| 15:29:42 | <hellwolf> | by pattern matching "failure", do you mean the type-level check of the type matching exhaustiveness, and the "_" implied last pattern maching? I don't suppose you mean the run-time pattern matching failure for non-exhaustive pattern matchings. |
| 15:29:42 | × | GdeVolpiano quits (~GdeVolpia@user/GdeVolpiano) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 15:30:18 | → | GdeVolpiano joins (~GdeVolpia@user/GdeVolpiano) |
| 15:32:10 | → | internatetional joins (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:5cc5:21af:ee80:fcb0) |
| 15:33:25 | <hellwolf> | though, your Fam case would be solved by making it a type class |
| 15:34:16 | <hellwolf> | instead of pattern matching, you use Dictionary with different code path... |
| 15:34:34 | × | internatetional_ quits (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:605b:9669:a8fc:b9c5) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 15:34:39 | <hellwolf> | isn't it what you need in runtime anyways? |
| 15:36:50 | ← | src parts (~src@user/src) () |
| 15:38:22 | <hellwolf> | see: https://play.haskell.org/saved/BLfTE47T |
| 15:39:11 | <hellwolf> | oh wait, let me finish the main function, and make overlappable work.. |
| 15:39:32 | <hellwolf> | yes, here you go https://play.haskell.org/saved/7zttMWH9 @tomsmeding |
| 15:41:15 | → | siraj joins (~siraj@36.255.85.255) |
| 15:41:34 | <hellwolf> | I guess instance resolution is the "expressiveness" you can use here. You might quickly hit UndecidableInstances if you start to use a lot of brief instance heads or type families. But I think they are still sound and consistent, from what I have heard and understood. |
| 15:41:43 | <tomsmeding> | hellwolf: oh the OVERLAPPABLE trick is cute |
| 15:42:05 | <tomsmeding> | but it's rather a lot of boilerplate, I guess |
| 15:42:13 | <hellwolf> | indeed. |
| 15:42:50 | <tomsmeding> | yes, that's what I want, but then in a normal function. :P |
| 15:43:12 | <tomsmeding> | I guess this works because STag is really a singleton |
| 15:43:23 | <hellwolf> | Only if we can leverage more the type level information from pattern maching exhaustiveness check |
| 15:43:36 | <hellwolf> | comparing to the instance resolution, that is rather blackbox to us. |
| 15:44:35 | <hellwolf> | tomsmeding: the boilerplate can be reduced by using default type class function implementation |
| 15:44:53 | <hellwolf> | but it's an ad-hoc thing, not sure if it scales to more situations. |
| 15:45:23 | <hellwolf> | oh, "default method signature" rather. but it is even more ad-hoc. |
| 15:54:17 | → | jacopovalanzano joins (~jacopoval@cpc151911-cove17-2-0-cust105.3-1.cable.virginm.net) |
| 15:54:51 | → | euphores joins (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) |
| 15:56:15 | × | internatetional quits (~nate@2001:448a:20a3:c2e5:5cc5:21af:ee80:fcb0) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 15:59:42 | × | siraj quits (~siraj@36.255.85.255) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 16:06:52 | → | tzh joins (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 16:07:34 | → | divya` joins (~user@139.5.11.143) |
| 16:18:06 | × | rit quits (~rit@2409:40e0:1c:121c:8974:a096:1a7b:cd3b) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 16:32:34 | → | lxsameer joins (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) |
| 16:36:32 | → | inca joins (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) |
| 16:40:29 | × | jespada quits (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 16:40:56 | hc_ | is now known as hc |
| 16:43:55 | → | jespada joins (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 16:53:49 | → | Unicorn_Princess joins (~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) |
| 16:58:02 | → | praneyak joins (~praneyak@2405:201:4005:3009:c10d:3767:8e4a:e057) |
| 17:01:09 | × | jespada quits (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 17:05:37 | → | vanishingideal joins (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) |
| 17:09:26 | → | __jmcantrell__ joins (~weechat@user/jmcantrell) |
| 17:11:26 | × | inca quits (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 17:16:59 | → | jespada joins (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 17:22:44 | → | inca joins (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) |
| 17:22:47 | × | lxsameer quits (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 17:27:47 | × | praneyak quits (~praneyak@2405:201:4005:3009:c10d:3767:8e4a:e057) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 17:31:36 | × | toby-bro quits (~toby-bro@user/toby-bro) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 17:34:59 | → | ljdarj joins (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) |
| 17:35:36 | × | chexum quits (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 17:36:24 | → | chexum joins (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) |
| 17:38:29 | × | jespada quits (~jespada@r186-49-242-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) (Read error: Connection timed out) |
| 17:42:03 | → | gmg joins (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
| 17:44:26 | × | inca quits (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 17:48:10 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 17:48:38 | → | inca joins (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) |
| 18:08:13 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) |
| 18:12:00 | → | sprotte24 joins (~sprotte24@p200300d16f1fcd0000e13fd95149a2bc.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:32:24 | → | ljdarj1 joins (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) |
| 18:36:11 | × | ljdarj quits (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 18:36:11 | ljdarj1 | is now known as ljdarj |
| 18:38:43 | × | inca quits (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 18:39:52 | → | CiaoSen joins (~Jura@2a02:8071:64e1:da0:5a47:caff:fe78:33db) |
| 18:50:24 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 18:51:32 | → | Sgeo joins (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
| 18:52:43 | <kqr> | I am trying to use strictness annotations for the first time. I get a syntax error on the ! before the field name in a record. I have enabled BangPatterns. Am I doing it wrong or missing something else? |
| 18:53:25 | <kqr> | I feel like I should find this by Google but I'm having a surprisingly hard time finding any hits on marking record fields strict. |
| 18:53:45 | <merijn> | kqr: Before the field names sounds wrong |
| 18:54:02 | <kqr> | Oh. Yeah. Thanks. |
| 18:54:13 | <merijn> | kqr: The correct way with a record would be: "myFun Foo{ myField = !myFieldBinding} = ..." |
| 18:54:29 | <merijn> | kqr: Or did you mean in the datatype? |
| 18:54:43 | <merijn> | (which, incidentally, shouldn't require bang patterns iirc) |
| 18:54:56 | <kqr> | In the datatype, yes. It's possible it might not require bang patterns. |
| 18:55:07 | <merijn> | I think ! in datatype is standard haskell |
| 18:55:13 | <merijn> | I think I have an example doing that somewhere |
| 18:55:16 | → | inca joins (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) |
| 18:55:58 | <merijn> | kqr: https://github.com/merijn/Belewitte/blob/ed95965077ee0a55c9a206b75445ddf93723916b/benchmark-analysis/src/Query/Step.hs#L37-L45 |
| 18:56:11 | <merijn> | It goes on the type annotation of the field |
| 18:59:34 | <kqr> | Yeah, you're right. I don't know why I imagined it would be on the field. |
| 19:00:01 | × | caconym quits (~caconym@user/caconym) (Quit: bye) |
| 19:00:39 | × | vanishingideal quits (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 19:00:43 | → | caconym joins (~caconym@user/caconym) |
| 19:01:40 | → | peterbecich joins (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) |
| 19:04:33 | × | inca quits (~inca@190.sub-174-226-85.myvzw.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 19:06:19 | × | divya` quits (~user@139.5.11.143) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 19:11:03 | <monochrom> | It is more natural on the field. :) "data T = T{ !i, j :: Int }" could mean i is strict, j is non-strict, both type Int. |
| 19:11:46 | <monochrom> | But Haskell didn't begin with that POV. It began with "data T = T !Int Int" and then bolted on record syntax as an afterthought. |
| 19:12:00 | <kqr> | Oh, really? I thought record syntax had been in there since forever |
| 19:12:20 | → | acidjnk_new3 joins (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f099ca861e17b9ec3ec.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:12:29 | <monochrom> | There is no conflict between afterthought and since forever. :) |
| 19:13:06 | <merijn> | kqr: I mean, at this point it has been forever :p |
| 19:15:34 | × | notdabs quits (~Owner@2600:1700:69cf:9000:58e6:6428:d346:1de6) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 19:16:52 | → | dhil joins (~dhil@2a0c:b381:52e:3600:696a:652d:93f2:5c60) |
| 19:21:32 | → | tabaqui joins (~tabaqui@167.71.80.236) |
| 19:22:16 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 19:24:06 | <haskellbridge> | <loonycyborg> main part with records I'm wondering about is why it's using "," instead of ";" so indentation can't be used to delineate records |
| 19:27:18 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 19:32:07 | → | harveypwca joins (~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:f6e0:27d6:8cc7:eca9:c46c) |
| 19:32:19 | <kqr> | Oh, that's a fun idea too. |
| 19:34:07 | <geekosaur> | if that's the only issue you have with records then you're doing pretty good |
| 19:34:14 | <merijn> | :p |
| 19:36:13 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 19:38:22 | <kqr> | I'm not sure I can describe this well, but I'll give it a shot. I have written a program that first builds a data structure and then queries that data structure 5000 times. its heap profile looks like this: https://i.xkqr.org/heapprofile01.png. from the start to the first trace marker is when it builds the data structure. between the trace markers is when it runs the first query. then after the |
| 19:38:24 | <kqr> | second trace marker to the end it runs 4999 more queries. |
| 19:39:22 | <kqr> | My interpretation of this is as follows: the data structure needs only 40 MB of memory because that's what it uses to answer the 4999 queries. But while building it, it uses up to 550 MB B. I would guess that's a space leak, right? |
| 19:39:43 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 19:39:47 | <kqr> | Also it seems like a lot of the data structure building" is deferred (thanks to laziness) until the first query runs. |
| 19:39:56 | <kqr> | Does that seem like a sensible interpretation? |
| 19:44:01 | <merijn> | kqr: The sensible interpretation is that computing your data structure takes 250 MB |
| 19:44:17 | <merijn> | kqr: Since that's what live bytes peaks at |
| 19:44:42 | <merijn> | kqr: The heap ends up being roughly double that, due to GHC using a copy & collect GC |
| 19:44:51 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 19:45:22 | <merijn> | kqr: Whether that's a space leak depends, it could just be that computing it takes that much memory |
| 19:45:25 | <merijn> | Hard to say |
| 19:46:33 | → | rvalue- joins (~rvalue@user/rvalue) |
| 19:46:43 | <c_wraith> | that does look like the shape you get from a space leak... But it could also be something that's just memory-intensive |
| 19:46:54 | <c_wraith> | surprisingly, those can look identical. |
| 19:47:05 | <c_wraith> | If you expect constant memory and see a triangle, that's a bad sign. |
| 19:47:12 | <merijn> | kqr: Also, have you dumped out a GC report too? |
| 19:47:18 | <c_wraith> | If you don't expect constant memory, you're going to have to be a lot more precise |
| 19:47:33 | × | rvalue quits (~rvalue@user/rvalue) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 19:49:22 | × | Unicorn_Princess quits (~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 19:52:46 | × | peterbecich quits (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 19:53:09 | rvalue- | is now known as rvalue |
| 19:53:25 | → | peterbecich joins (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) |
| 19:57:30 | × | peterbecich quits (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 19:57:31 | → | machinedgod joins (~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) |
| 20:18:15 | <monochrom> | My editor can indent on , just fine. |
| 20:19:32 | <merijn> | monochrom: He meant having indent for grouping |
| 20:19:39 | <merijn> | like do notation |
| 20:21:46 | <monochrom> | Yes, I can have a column of { , , , } for a record, just like I can have a column of [ , , , ] for a list, or a column of { ; ; ; } for a do-block. |
| 20:22:30 | × | mrmr quits (~mrmr@user/mrmr) (Quit: Bye, See ya later!) |
| 20:25:18 | <monochrom> | OK memory footprint of Haskell data structures. If you have a list of n elements, just the list nodes and the pointers to elements, not counting the elements themselves, are already 24n bytes. |
| 20:25:33 | <monochrom> | If each element is Int, that's another 16 bytes per Int. |
| 20:27:21 | <monochrom> | In general, for an algebraic data type, every data constructor becomes 8 bytes, every field becomes an 8-byte pointer to the field value. (If the field type is also an algebraic data type, repeat.) |
| 20:29:54 | <monochrom> | On top of that, GHC's default GC is a copying collector, which means space-isomorphic to double buffering in computer graphics rendering. If your ADT takes 500MB after the above calculation, don't be surprised to use GHC RTS occupying 1GB. |
| 20:30:12 | <monochrom> | s/use/see/ |
| 20:31:19 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) |
| 20:32:05 | <monochrom> | An example from back in the XML days was someone reading from a "merely" 50MB XML file into a Haskell XML tree and resulting in 1GB. |
| 20:32:33 | <monochrom> | Actually back then it was "just" 500MB "just because" it was 32-bit GHC so everything was halved. |
| 20:33:46 | → | toby-bro joins (~toby-bro@user/toby-bro) |
| 20:34:33 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 20:35:59 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 20:36:34 | → | sprotte24_ joins (~sprotte24@p200300d16f1fcd00fde87e4fa26f8820.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:37:26 | → | j1n37- joins (~j1n37@user/j1n37) |
| 20:37:30 | × | j1n37 quits (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 20:40:40 | × | sprotte24 quits (~sprotte24@p200300d16f1fcd0000e13fd95149a2bc.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 20:42:50 | → | takuan_dozo joins (~takuan@d8D86B601.access.telenet.be) |
| 20:42:50 | × | takuan quits (~takuan@d8D86B601.access.telenet.be) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 20:45:21 | × | CiaoSen quits (~Jura@2a02:8071:64e1:da0:5a47:caff:fe78:33db) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 20:46:19 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 21:00:26 | → | thuna` joins (~thuna`@user/thuna/x-1480069) |
| 21:02:52 | × | AlexZenon quits (~alzenon@178.34.162.245) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 21:04:52 | → | AlexZenon joins (~alzenon@178.34.162.245) |
| 21:06:26 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) |
| 21:09:55 | × | hgolden quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:1b03:b08c:d961:6530) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 21:11:29 | → | hgolden joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:1b03:b08c:d961:6530) |
| 21:12:43 | × | hgolden quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:1b03:b08c:d961:6530) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 21:15:00 | × | xff0x quits (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:c94:b4ca:3e28:1c70) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 21:18:46 | → | hgolden joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:1b03:b08c:d961:6530) |
| 21:26:11 | × | tremon quits (~tremon@83.80.159.219) (Quit: getting boxed in) |
| 21:29:34 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 21:29:47 | × | wootehfoot quits (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 21:33:40 | <haskellbridge> | <loonycyborg> rn wasting 1GB isn't so bad in general considering that 32/64Gb setups are common on pc |
| 21:35:28 | × | connrs quits (~connrs@user/connrs) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 21:35:35 | → | connrs joins (~connrs@user/connrs) |
| 21:36:18 | <haskellbridge> | <loonycyborg> Pretty sure this could be optimized with bang patterns and unboxed types too |
| 21:37:09 | → | tromp joins (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) |
| 21:37:47 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 21:39:46 | × | connrs quits (~connrs@user/connrs) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 21:39:54 | → | connrs joins (~connrs@user/connrs) |
| 21:42:01 | → | ljdarj1 joins (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) |
| 21:43:09 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 21:44:04 | × | connrs quits (~connrs@user/connrs) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 21:44:11 | → | connrs joins (~connrs@user/connrs) |
| 21:45:48 | × | ljdarj quits (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 21:45:48 | ljdarj1 | is now known as ljdarj |
| 21:50:53 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) |
| 21:51:35 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 22:00:04 | × | gmg quits (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:00:34 | × | chexum quits (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:00:45 | → | chexum joins (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) |
| 22:00:47 | → | gmg joins (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
| 22:02:56 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 22:04:04 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@70.27.118.207) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 22:07:41 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 22:09:25 | × | dhil quits (~dhil@2a0c:b381:52e:3600:696a:652d:93f2:5c60) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 22:11:43 | × | tromp quits (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:44a6:f61b:e8c3:9514) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 22:13:20 | × | rini quits (~rini@user/rini) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:13:33 | × | connrs quits (~connrs@user/connrs) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:13:41 | → | connrs joins (~connrs@user/connrs) |
| 22:19:09 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 22:25:23 | × | takuan_dozo quits (~takuan@d8D86B601.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:30:58 | → | hgolden_ joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:fa19:a3fb:34bb:67a4) |
| 22:31:09 | × | __monty__ quits (~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving) |
| 22:33:59 | × | hgolden quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:1b03:b08c:d961:6530) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 22:41:34 | × | toby-bro quits (~toby-bro@user/toby-bro) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 22:46:02 | jmcantrell | is now known as Guest4344 |
| 22:46:02 | × | Guest4344 quits (644f1bed9a@user/jmcantrell) (Killed (molybdenum.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) |
| 22:46:02 | __jmcantrell__ | is now known as jmcantrell |
| 22:46:10 | → | jmcantrell_ joins (644f1bed9a@user/jmcantrell) |
| 22:49:59 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 22:52:58 | → | vanishingideal joins (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) |
| 22:55:18 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 23:06:42 | × | hgolden_ quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:fa19:a3fb:34bb:67a4) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 23:08:55 | → | hgolden joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:fa19:a3fb:34bb:67a4) |
| 23:09:00 | × | anpad quits (~pandeyan@user/anpad) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
| 23:11:05 | → | anpad joins (~pandeyan@user/anpad) |
| 23:13:30 | × | robobub quits (uid248673@id-248673.uxbridge.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 23:16:46 | × | target_i quits (~target_i@user/target-i/x-6023099) (Quit: leaving) |
| 23:24:21 | → | hgolden_ joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:6ff3:8389:b901:6363) |
| 23:24:47 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 23:26:10 | × | hgolden quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:fa19:a3fb:34bb:67a4) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 23:26:26 | → | JuanDaugherty joins (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) |
| 23:32:12 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 23:34:10 | × | hiredman quits (~hiredman@frontier1.downey.family) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 23:34:34 | → | rawles joins (~rawles@user/rawles) |
| 23:36:09 | × | m5zs7k quits (aquares@web10.mydevil.net) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 23:36:53 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 23:40:18 | → | m5zs7k joins (aquares@web10.mydevil.net) |
| 23:44:59 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> ! we'll pretend we didn't hear that |
| 23:45:18 | → | hattckory joins (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 23:47:10 | <EvanR> | ikr |
| 23:47:59 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 23:49:37 | → | hgolden__ joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:2fa6:8257:2d41:b9b0) |
| 23:50:33 | × | hattckory quits (~hattckory@bras-base-toroon4524w-grc-30-70-27-118-207.dsl.bell.ca) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 23:51:30 | × | sprotte24_ quits (~sprotte24@p200300d16f1fcd00fde87e4fa26f8820.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 23:52:15 | → | hgolden joins (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:d319:57ed:d2cb:68a5) |
| 23:52:44 | × | hgolden_ quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:6ff3:8389:b901:6363) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 23:53:57 | × | hgolden__ quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:2fa6:8257:2d41:b9b0) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 23:56:20 | <monochrom> | The cause of concern is that you will not run your web app on your PC, you will run it on virtual hosting where your budget allows only 0.5GB RAM for example. |
| 23:57:19 | → | todi joins (~todi@p57803331.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:57:42 | × | todi1 quits (~todi@p57803331.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 23:58:34 | × | hgolden quits (~hgolden@2603:8000:9d00:3ed1:d319:57ed:d2cb:68a5) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
All times are in UTC on 2025-04-05.