Logs on 2025-06-25 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 00:06:34 | <c_wraith> | poliquin: you might also be in one of the cases where https://downloads.haskell.org/ghc/latest/docs/users_guide/exts/primitives.html#extension-UnliftedDatatypes is actually reasonable. Though if it is, you might first consider whether an array representation might be even better. |
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| 00:43:49 | <poliquin> | c_wraith: thanks for the replies .. I'm not sure I have the right intuitions for thinking through memory effects of all my functions .. but Unlifted Datatypes may be the Thor's hammer that I'm looking for as I've spent two days on this and I'm under a deadline .. Thanks again! |
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| 02:14:31 | <Nosrep> | hm |
| 02:14:38 | <Nosrep> | whys hoogle not showing anything significant from vector |
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| 02:16:12 | <geekosaur> | package vector is the second thing in the list? |
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| 02:16:29 | <Nosrep> | well yeah but like if i search for the actual vector type or mvector i get nothing |
| 02:18:03 | <geekosaur> | hm, right, just found that |
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| 07:11:24 | [exa] | found a new way to explain ContT to beginners |
| 07:11:30 | [exa] | tempted to write another monad tutorial |
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| 07:13:33 | <dminuoso> | ContT: The programming monad. |
| 07:14:05 | <dminuoso> | I finally understood delimited continuations recently, what a revelation. |
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| 07:34:47 | <[exa]> | dminuoso: yeah, that's the word that captures it best. revelation. |
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| 07:55:10 | <tomsmeding> | "A Monad Tutorial. Or: The Revelation of ContT in Programming" |
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| 10:16:26 | <dminuoso> | [exa]: Curious though, what novel way did you find? |
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| 10:37:05 | <vetkat> | yea, there are some simple things in Haskell which just keep on amazing me. For example, lazy evaluation; just do map this function to an infinite list with a takeWhile and everything will be fine. It's easy, but also super convenient |
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| 10:42:38 | <hc> | I agree it has its fascinations; lazy evaluation has its problems, too, though ;-) |
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| 10:42:59 | <hc> | For example, use foldl and all of a sudden you may have a huge memory consumption problem ;p |
| 10:43:24 | <hc> | Using lazy evaluation in conjunction with operations that may fail (i.e., IO) is also troublesome and some alternative concepts have been developed (conduits) |
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| 11:06:04 | <vetkat> | ghe, yea, I may have encountered issues with foldl and memory consumption |
| 11:06:22 | <vetkat> | also no filter :( |
| 11:06:32 | <vetkat> | which I understand, but still |
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| 11:07:51 | <__monty__> | No filter? |
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| 11:52:18 | <ski> | [exa] : call it a "ContTutorial" |
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| 12:39:27 | <poliquin> | For the record I found the space leak .. I used -hr and eventlog2html .. That narrowed it down to about 300 lines of code .. and there it was! the Simstate record had a wDebug :: Char .. it was adding one byte (trivial) every cycle thru the Sim .. however .. there were 20 billion cycles! Death by 20 billion cuts! Thanks for the support .. and later I may need Thor's hammer .. |
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| 14:06:36 | <geekosaur> | bridge going down briefly for docker upgrade |
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| 17:13:24 | <monochrom> | [exa]: Would your explanation of ContT be similar to http://blog.sigfpe.com/2011/10/quick-and-dirty-reinversion-of-control.html ? |
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| 17:15:26 | <monochrom> | or maybe my https://www.vex.net/~trebla/haskell/cont.xhtml but I have only covered Cont without T. |
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| 17:39:15 | <Nosrep> | https://github.com/haskell/vector/issues/521 vector thing from yesterday |
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| 17:40:19 | <EvanR> | clearance clarence |
| 17:40:23 | <EvanR> | roger roger |
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| 18:46:47 | <[exa]> | monochrom: no in the end mine was a bit like ResourceT, "you should squash your 666 levels of `bracket` into a nice `do`" |
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| 18:52:30 | <[exa]> | monochrom: and it shows very directly how to feed the stuff into the actual transformer (the main issue I had with explaining it "the continuation way first" to folks was to disambiguate the `a` from `r` with sufficient intuitive power; if you do the bracket as ContT (\rest -> someInit *> rest someData <* someFinalizer) it gets quite obvious) |
| 18:54:08 | <[exa]> | (this isn't a "true bracket" because no errors handled, but it's easy to see how the real bracket plugs in) |
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| 18:59:27 | <tomsmeding> | magic_rb: you online? |
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| 19:50:45 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> tomsmeding |
| 19:50:47 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> yes |
| 19:51:05 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> but the IRC bridge is down |
| 19:51:47 | <c_wraith> | I guess it's back up now |
| 19:52:03 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> well my bridge |
| 19:52:05 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> he cant DM me |
| 19:52:28 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> im going through the bridged room by geekosaur |
| 19:53:23 | <tomsmeding> | magic_rb: where and what time is your defence tomorrow |
| 19:53:33 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> 14:00 VU |
| 19:53:33 | <tomsmeding> | I will be at https://conf.researchr.org/home/dfdm-2025#program |
| 19:53:42 | <tomsmeding> | oh I guess that's not close by, is it? |
| 19:54:10 | <tomsmeding> | no other side of the city |
| 19:54:11 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> its the UvA where your thing is |
| 19:54:14 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> yeah |
| 19:54:24 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> my session will hopefully be recorded, ill send you the recording for sure |
| 19:54:41 | <tomsmeding> | then I can't be there I think, sorry -- if it was on the uva campus I would have snuck out |
| 19:54:52 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> yeah no problem |
| 19:54:57 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> sad that its overlapping |
| 19:55:05 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> i can also present again in september :P |
| 19:55:05 | <tomsmeding> | yes |
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| 19:55:18 | <tomsmeding> | lol why? |
| 19:55:51 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> why not lol |
| 19:55:55 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> just unofficially |
| 19:56:05 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> ill present probably also at zurihac if they accept the talk |
| 19:56:06 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> in a year |
| 19:56:08 | <tomsmeding> | oh that way |
| 19:56:11 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> ye |
| 19:56:14 | <tomsmeding> | cool |
| 19:56:16 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> i like presenting |
| 19:56:29 | <tomsmeding> | useful thing to like :p |
| 19:56:41 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> yeah im very social |
| 19:56:48 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> as you probably figured out |
| 19:56:53 | <tomsmeding> | :) |
| 19:56:59 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> i still need to finish the fucking presentation, i just got some results |
| 19:57:03 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> theyre complete bollocks |
| 19:57:09 | <tomsmeding> | nice! |
| 19:57:11 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> somehow my thing is faster than the kernel, im measuring it wrong |
| 19:57:14 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> but i dont know why |
| 19:57:17 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> or how |
| 19:57:18 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> or what |
| 19:57:24 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> so 🤷 |
| 19:57:37 | <tomsmeding> | are you including kernel context switching in the measurement? |
| 19:57:51 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> yes |
| 19:57:55 | <tomsmeding> | I'm not sure how long that takes |
| 19:58:06 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> like, my thing should be much much slower |
| 19:58:06 | <tomsmeding> | compared to the actual FS computations, that is |
| 19:58:16 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> i measured it at some point and i was getting 40% of kernel |
| 19:58:24 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> now im measuring and im getting 200% of kernel |
| 19:58:25 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> idfk why |
| 19:58:29 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> idc at this point lol |
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| 19:58:46 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> ill even say in the presentation, "these numbers are funny, i have no clue why, i ran out of time for this" |
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| 19:59:17 | <tomsmeding> | weren't you supposed to hand in your thesis some time before the defence already? |
| 19:59:23 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> no |
| 19:59:25 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> other way |
| 19:59:26 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> for us |
| 19:59:27 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> lol |
| 19:59:30 | <tomsmeding> | interesting |
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| 22:57:10 | × | tmciver quits (~tim@syn-198-255-177-240.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 22:59:01 | → | tmciver joins (~tim@syn-198-255-177-240.res.spectrum.com) |
| 22:59:33 | × | machinedgod quits (~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 23:02:14 | × | j1n37 quits (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 23:04:22 | × | Tuplanolla quits (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 23:05:39 | → | j1n37 joins (~j1n37@user/j1n37) |
| 23:06:55 | × | j1n37 quits (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 23:07:03 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 23:09:45 | → | j1n37 joins (~j1n37@user/j1n37) |
| 23:13:57 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 23:16:14 | × | j1n37 quits (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 23:24:29 | → | Square joins (~Square@user/square) |
| 23:24:34 | → | Sgeo joins (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
| 23:25:05 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 23:30:14 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 23:35:48 | → | j1n37 joins (~j1n37@user/j1n37) |
| 23:40:53 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
| 23:45:32 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 23:47:15 | × | yin quits (~z@user/zero) (Quit: quit) |
| 23:47:41 | × | j1n37 quits (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 23:51:27 | → | j1n37 joins (~j1n37@user/j1n37) |
| 23:55:00 | → | yin joins (~z@user/zero) |
| 23:56:20 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
All times are in UTC on 2025-06-25.