Logs on 2025-09-06 (liberachat/#haskell)
| 00:00:16 | → | Nosrep joins (~jimothy@user/nosrep) |
| 00:04:07 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 00:05:25 | × | ttybitnik quits (~ttybitnik@user/wolper) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 00:15:03 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
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| 00:31:17 | × | img quits (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
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| 00:35:16 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 00:35:33 | × | segfaultfizzbuzz quits (~segfaultf@23-93-74-222.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
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| 01:08:01 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 01:19:20 | → | merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) |
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| 01:39:18 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 01:42:16 | × | vanishingideal quits (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
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| 01:47:32 | arahael_ | is now known as arahael |
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| 02:01:47 | × | Googulator quits (~Googulato@2a01-036d-0106-28ad-1d1d-edbe-776a-384c.pool6.digikabel.hu) (Quit: Client closed) |
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| 02:31:00 | × | img quits (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
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| 02:52:18 | × | stef204 quits (~stef204@user/stef204) (Quit: WeeChat 4.2.1) |
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| 03:27:22 | × | petrichor quits (~jez@user/petrichor) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
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| 04:19:48 | × | Nosrep quits (~jimothy@user/nosrep) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
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| 06:47:27 | × | anpad quits (~pandeyan@user/anpad) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
| 06:50:04 | × | weary-traveler quits (~user@user/user363627) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 06:55:24 | × | wootehfoot quits (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 07:00:04 | × | caconym747 quits (~caconym@user/caconym) (Quit: bye) |
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| 07:36:52 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 07:43:23 | × | YoungFrog quits (~youngfrog@2a02:a03f:ca07:f900:ca4d:9826:59ab:a422) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.x-git-3-96481995 - https://znc.in) |
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| 08:49:03 | trickard_ | is now known as trickard |
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| 09:32:06 | × | metabulation quits (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Quit: Leaving) |
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| 12:12:37 | <bwe> | map (f1 . f2 . f3 . author) book -- how do I write this in point-free style with OverloadedRecordDot enabled? `map (f1 . f2 . f3 . .author) book` doesn't work. Say if I don't want to introduce \x notation here. |
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| 12:19:08 | <ncf> | https://ghc.gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/doc/users_guide/exts/overloaded_record_dot.html |
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| 12:27:39 | <Rembane> | You can also use (<<<) from Control.Arrow. |
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| 12:36:25 | <ski> | "You may also write (.b) to mean a function that “projects the b field from its argument”. For example, (.b) a means the same thing as a.b)." |
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| 12:38:00 | <bwe> | ncf+ski: Thanks, I should put more faith in the docs. |
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| 16:13:32 | <monochrom> | Isn't it simpler (and reflecting deeper understanding) to just change ".author" to "author"? |
| 16:14:02 | <monochrom> | "x.author" is just syntax sugar for "author x". |
| 16:15:04 | <monochrom> | This is Sapir-Worf at work. Syntax ruins minds. |
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| 16:19:29 | <EvanR> | syntax as a end user tool to leverage a large body of expertise in some context, like shorthand on order slips in a diner |
| 16:19:39 | <EvanR> | useless without the expertise and background |
| 16:19:52 | <EvanR> | certainly no way to learn something *physics looking at you* |
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| 17:16:00 | <exfalsoquodlibet> | .quit |
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| 17:16:57 | <geekosaur> | it's /quit |
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| 17:21:48 | <monochrom> | Or maybe it was a joke about the .author discussion earlier. :) |
| 17:22:14 | <Clint> | we'll never know |
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| 17:22:56 | <monochrom> | OverloadedForwardSlashNotation |
| 17:24:50 | <monochrom> | Oh hey that inspires me. Overloaded Prolog Forward Slash Overloading Notation! It means that foo/1, foo/2, and foo/3 are three distinct identifiers. |
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| 18:09:54 | <dminuoso> | This dot notation is a quirky example of how retrofitting features into an existing language can be incredibly awkward and hard, much like bolting a type system onto Python is a seemingly hopeless task. |
| 18:10:53 | <dminuoso> | I consider lens/optics to be a far superior user interface to RecordDotSyntax which is quirky and unexpected in plentiful ways. |
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| 18:19:21 | <geekosaur> | agreed |
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| 18:47:46 | <davean> | dminuoso: I can not fathom why people want RecordDotSyntax over lenses |
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| 18:48:41 | <dminuoso> | Well if you have ever seen the lens type errors... |
| 18:49:14 | <dminuoso> | Random unsatisfied Contravariant constraint. |
| 18:49:19 | <dminuoso> | Ugh... |
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| 18:49:44 | <dminuoso> | But there's optics at least. |
| 18:49:44 | <davean> | Yah there were some ways to work on that that happened. |
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| 22:04:20 | <alienmind> | hi. i'm trying to install rasterific but can't because i'm getting missing file errors. 'ghc-pkg check' reveals a lot of packages missing 'haddock-html' and 'haddock-interfaces' files. these files seem to be missing in packages installed by pacman. i tried deleteing '~/.cabal' and running 'cabal install --reinstall Rasterific', however it results in the same missing file error. how might i proceed? |
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| 22:12:54 | <alienmind> | ok ive thought of an approach. i'm going to extract the missing files and directories from the ghc-pkg errors and touch them all |
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| 22:28:13 | <geekosaur> | those should be warnings, not errors, since documentation builds are optional (you would need `documentation: True` in your cabal config or --enable-documentation on the command line) |
| 22:28:25 | <tomsmeding> | alienmind: assuming you're on arch linux: either install ghc-static and hope for the best, or uninstall ghc from pacman and get haskell stuff from ghcup instead |
| 22:28:36 | <geekosaur> | for pacman, they may have separate documentation packages |
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| 22:28:52 | <tomsmeding> | the haskell situation in the arch linux repos is a running joke here |
| 22:29:16 | <tomsmeding> | ( https://www.haskell.org/ghcup/ ) |
| 22:32:33 | <tomsmeding> | if you still have missing files issues with ghcup, tell us precisely what errors you get when running which commands (use e.g. the pastebin in the topic) |
| 22:32:54 | <tomsmeding> | I'll be sleeping for ~9 hours now but others might pick it up :) |
| 22:33:33 | <geekosaur> | right, you are most likely missing the static packages that Arch deliberately removes and which will prevent pretty much anything they don't package from installing |
| 22:33:53 | <geekosaur> | as tomsmeding said, the only real fix is to ditch Arch's ghc entirely and use ghcup |
| 22:34:17 | <alienmind> | i'm getting a new laptop. i'm going to install nix on it |
| 22:34:18 | <geekosaur> | Arch only cares about packaging the minimum needed to package pandoc built dynamically |
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| 23:00:07 | <anselmschueler> | does anyone know if Stack have fixed their Nix integration so it doesn’t just completely fail any time a GHC version is not in nixpkgs? |
| 23:00:33 | <anselmschueler> | last time I tried it Stack just generated the package name for the GHC version and if it wasn’t called that or wasn’t there it would just fail immediately |
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| 23:21:40 | <slondr> | hi, I have ghc and haskell-language-server installed via GHCup, but when I run lsp in emacs I get: Failed to find the GHC version of this Defaul project. |
| 23:22:26 | <slondr> | does this look familiar to anyone? |
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| 23:26:37 | <geekosaur> | what version of cabal did you install? the LSP uses cabal to find out what ghc version a project uses, but the latest HLS doesn't work with the latest cabal (this will be fixed in the next cabal release, scheduled for when ghc 9.14.1 comes out because some tweaks were needed for that as well) |
| 23:27:05 | <slondr> | I just accepted all of the default suggestions |
| 23:27:11 | <slondr> | So maybe that is the problem? |
| 23:27:13 | <geekosaur> | okay, then that's not it |
| 23:29:57 | <geekosaur> | the default cabal version in ghcup is 3.12.1.0, it's 3.16.0.0 that breaks current HLS. (which won't be updated for it until ghc 9.14.1 is released and HLS can be updated to support its ghc-lib) |
| 23:30:46 | <slondr> | yes my cabal version is 3.12.1.0 and my hls version is 9.4.8 |
| 23:31:00 | × | merijn quits (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 23:31:22 | <geekosaur> | you mean ghc version? |
| 23:31:30 | <geekosaur> | HLS versions don't go that high |
| 23:32:18 | <geekosaur> | also that sounds like an out of date ghcup, or at least ghcup metadata; current metadata has 9.6.7 as recommended |
| 23:32:51 | <slondr> | oh! that's a clue |
| 23:33:02 | <slondr> | my hls binary is named "haskell-language-server-9.4.8" |
| 23:33:38 | <slondr> | It looks like I also have haskell-language-server-9.6.7 |
| 23:36:16 | <slondr> | emacs lsp reports: ghc 9.6.7, cabal 3.12.1.0, stack 3.3.1 |
| 23:36:48 | <slondr> | I also see: libc.so.6: undefined symbol: __nptl_change_stack_perm, version GLIBC_PRIVATE |
| 23:39:01 | <geekosaur> | right, you need an HLS binary for each ghc version because the ghc-api it uses must match |
| 23:39:16 | <geekosaur> | the undefined symbol one sounds like much more of a problem |
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| 23:41:05 | <slondr> | I'm on glibc 2.42 should I expect hls to support that? |
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| 23:42:13 | <geekosaur> | the question is whether or how your glibc supports linux's native posix threads library (the "nptl" in that symbol) |
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| 23:44:12 | <geekosaur> | if you can find libc.so.6, can you run it as if it were a program and if so what does it say for "libc ABIs"? |
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| 23:44:35 | <slondr> | libc ABIs: UNIQUE IFUNC ABSOLUTE |
| 23:45:18 | <geekosaur> | okay, so that's not it (same here) |
| 23:45:30 | <geekosaur> | also I have 2.41 but it's Ubuntu's build |
| 23:45:43 | <slondr> | yeah I just have the normal default Arch Linux glibc |
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| 23:47:33 | <geekosaur> | this might be a question for maerwald, but the answer may again be "give up on the Arch ghc install" because it just causes too many problems for Haskell maintainers |
| 23:47:54 | <slondr> | ah you see, i have already done that. my ghc is from GHCup. |
| 23:48:07 | <slondr> | I ran GHCup via the curl | bash command on the website |
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| 23:51:40 | <geekosaur> | okay, if Arch changed their glibc recently then ghcup's release builds probably need to be adjusted |
| 23:52:00 | <slondr> | wait wait wait wait. the glibc error seems to be referencing a glibc version installed by nix |
| 23:52:25 | <slondr> | which seems almost certainly wrong, I'd want ghc to reference the system glibc not some random nix derivation glibc |
| 23:52:52 | <geekosaur> | https://github.com/NixOS/patchelf |
| 23:53:43 | <geekosaur> | nix really wants to be hermetic, but that can break things pretty thoroughly when it comes to stuff like glibc |
| 23:54:42 | <slondr> | I don't want ghc to reference anything nix-related at all |
| 23:54:47 | <slondr> | I'm not sure why it does |
| 23:55:42 | <geekosaur> | make sure nix isn't substituting its own ghc for the one you intended to use |
| 23:55:56 | <geekosaur> | the ghc from ghcup won't know about nix |
| 23:56:16 | <slondr> | 'which ghc' reports: $HOME/.ghcup/bin/ghc |
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| 23:57:07 | <slondr> | though 'echo $PATH' sure does report that the /nix bin directories are above the ghcup bin directories, hmm |
| 23:57:44 | <geekosaur> | shells cache paths, but something run in a subshell or by a program you run from that shell won;t see the cache and will find the nix one first in that case |
| 23:59:54 | <geekosaur> | that said, nix wouldn't insert a ghc into your path unless you're in a directorry with a shell.nix and something knows enough about nix to see that file and load the derivations it specifies |
All times are in UTC on 2025-09-06.