Logs on 2025-09-07 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 00:00:14 | <slondr> | yeah that's definitely not the case here. I'm in a blank directory with one .hs file |
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| 00:28:18 | <geekosaur> | there is one more thing you can try but it's a bit involved |
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| 00:31:29 | <geekosaur> | ghcup's ghc "binary" is actually a shell script wrapper. you would need to extract the path to the actual ghc binary from it and run `LD_BIND_NOW=1 ldd` on it (at least, I think LD_BIND_NOW works there; not certain) and see if you get the same error. you will also get the path to the glibc (libc.so.6) it's trying to use, but it may be hidden among a bunch of Haskell shared objects. (but in my case it's actually right at the end of the list) |
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| 00:32:59 | <geekosaur> | oh, looks like instead of the `LD_BIND_NOW=1` part you could use `ldd -r` |
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| 01:56:32 | <ski> | monochrom : fwiw, in Prolog, those are not identifiers, but a predicate indicator |
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| 02:01:24 | <monochrom> | They indicate arities. But then, foo/1 and foo/2 can be completely unrelated, even though socially people try not to abuse that freedom. |
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| 02:03:16 | <ski> | yes |
| 02:03:51 | <monochrom> | There is also a step of "inspiration" meaning distortion when I think about "what can this syntax do for Haskell?" |
| 02:03:55 | <ski> | sometimes people use a higher arity, for a helper/worker predicate, e.g. introducing an accumulator |
| 02:04:46 | <monochrom> | Arity is elusive in Haskell. So may as well "simplify" and just say this is additional syntax for moar identifiers! |
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| 02:07:05 | <geekosaur> | people do that already with ticks |
| 02:07:11 | <geekosaur> | not to say `go` |
| 02:07:35 | <ski> | generally, i prefer a naming like e.g. sum_list_add/3, with the understanding that `sum_list_add(Numbers,Initial,Total) <=> sum_list(Numbers,Sum),Total is Initial + Sum'. or flatten_tree_append/3, with `flatten_tree_append(Tree,Suffix,List) <=> flatten_tree(Tree,Elements),append(Elements,Suffix,List)' |
| 02:08:28 | <ski> | or, if there's no such reasonable naming, at least adding `_aux' or similar, to the end of the predicate name, to indicate that it's a worker/helper for the other predicate |
| 02:09:59 | <ski> | in Haskell, we could have `reverse xs = revAppend xs []', where `revAppend' is specified (not implemented) by `revAppend xs suffix = reverse xs ++ suffix' |
| 02:11:25 | <monochrom> | I empathize with not wanting to think up names for helpers. I too suffer from spending 10% time writing up the helper and 90% time finding a good name for it. |
| 02:12:04 | <monochrom> | "go" works in Haskell because local scope. Prolog has no such luxury. |
| 02:12:29 | <monochrom> | (One of two reasons I don't want to teach Prolog actually.) |
| 02:13:18 | <Clint> | the other is harmful cuts? |
| 02:13:23 | <monochrom> | Yeah. |
| 02:13:26 | <ski> | oh .. and i also use similar naming, for versions of a predicate, or function, specialized to a particular constructor. e.g. `orderedCons' specified by `orderedCons x xs = ordered (x : xs)' (and also having `ordered [] = True'), implemented by `orderedCons _ [] = True; orderedCons x0 (x1 : xs) = x0 <= x1 && orderedCons x1 xs' |
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| 02:14:01 | <ski> | yea .. cuts are rather bad |
| 02:15:20 | <ski> | and i do use `loop'/`go', or similar, for a local helper or loop, often. but if there's an obvious reasonable name along the lines above, i tend to go with that, possiblly also exporting the operation |
| 02:16:18 | <ski> | Mercury is nicer than Prolog, in that it has no cuts. also has automatic conjunct reordering, so it can be easier to use multiple modes of a predicate (or function) |
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| 02:17:52 | <ski> | there are two main reasons for why cut is bad. (a) that it is inherently illogical, non-declarative (and also very easy to accidentally make your predicate "non-steeadfast" (not monotone, in terms of information about the parameters), if you're not careful) |
| 02:18:01 | <monochrom> | I know how to teach delimited continuation. That is, with an explicit delimiter like "reset" that the programmer is allowed to place anywhere. I would agree to teach cut if it had the same explicit place-anywhere-you-see-fit delimiter rather than "the delimiter is the owning predicate, therefore you must always define a helper predicate". |
| 02:18:30 | <monochrom> | s/define/contrive/ |
| 02:18:55 | <monochrom> | Now also cross that with no local definitions. |
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| 02:19:52 | <ski> | but also (b), that it implicitly refers to the "current clause", just as `return' refers to the current function, and `break',`continue' refers to the current (innermost enclosing) loop (or `switch', for the former), in C. this means that you can't naively factor out (or the reverse) a piece of code (taking care to parameterize on the variables that cross the boundary of the factored-out code) |
| 02:21:33 | <ski> | you could have (a) without (b). using the conditional, `( Condition -> Consequent ; Alternate )', in Prolog amounts to (a) without (b). many Prologs also have a version of this that does not cut away all but the first solution of `Condition', which behaves better, logically/declaratively. this latter is also what Mercury does |
| 02:22:14 | <ski> | "would agree to teach cut if it had the same explicit place-anywhere-you-see-fit delimiter" -- exactly |
| 02:22:27 | <ski> | (a) is "just" a kind of side-effect |
| 02:22:52 | <ski> | (b) is "syntactic dynamic scope" |
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| 02:23:54 | <ski> | i really would like a logic programming language, with a convenient and reasonable way to have local definitions |
| 02:25:06 | <ski> | you can make them, in lambdaProlog (and Twelf) .. but would like some syntactic sugar, and implicit quantification, on top of the basic semantic feature |
| 02:26:23 | <monochrom> | I have started teaching Curry for the logic programming part of my course. (The FP part is Haskell. This means confusingly I teach one syntax with two different semantics haha.) And I think Verse is even better (semantics is well-balanced between theory and pragmatism). |
| 02:26:37 | <ski> | traditionally, a logic program is seen as a sequence of clauses, each terminated by a full stop. ideally, the syntax for terminating/separating top-level clauses from each otheer should be the same as for local clauses |
| 02:27:17 | <ski> | yea, Curry (and Escher) uses a Haskell-like syntax. but they also use `=' rather than implication |
| 02:27:33 | <ski> | i dunno Verge |
| 02:30:12 | <ski> | btw, you can reason about, introduce, (b), in Lisp macro system. specifically, in some Scheme systems, you can have it as an opt-in feature. Racket has "syntax parameters", which are "parameters" (dynamic scope), but on the level of "syntax" (macros) |
| 02:31:23 | <monochrom> | Verse is Tim Sweeney's language. Eventually it will have all paradigms. SPJ joined Epic and published a paper on the functional logic part. |
| 02:31:52 | <ski> | oh. it's supposed to be usable for parts of game engine stuff ? |
| 02:33:24 | <monochrom> | It is Fortnight's script language or something like that. |
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| 02:33:59 | <monochrom> | Err, or Unreal Engine, yeah. |
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| 02:40:16 | <monochrom> | This: https://simon.peytonjones.org/verse-calculus/ |
| 02:47:55 | <ski> | in lambdaProlog, you can write |
| 02:48:18 | <ski> | reverse Xs0 RevXs0 :- |
| 02:48:32 | <ski> | pi loop \ |
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| 02:49:18 | <ski> | ( loop nil RevXs0 |
| 02:49:52 | <ski> | => ( pi X \ pi Xs \ pi Acc \ |
| 02:50:07 | <ski> | ( loop (X :: Xs) Acc :- |
| 02:50:13 | <ski> | loop Xs (X :: Acc) |
| 02:50:21 | <ski> | ) |
| 02:50:31 | <ski> | ) |
| 02:50:39 | <ski> | => loop Xs0 nil |
| 02:50:41 | <ski> | ). |
| 02:51:52 | <ski> | here `loop' is a local predicate (also notice how the first clause of `loop' non-locally will instantiate the parameter `RevXs0' of `reverse', when reaching the base case, end of list, so that we don't need to pass up the final result of the accumulator up the recursion chain) |
| 02:53:16 | <ski> | but, it's annoying to have to explicitly quantify the parameters of the local clauses (not including `RevXs0'), and also to have to locally quantifier `loop'. and syntactically, it's annoying that the local clauses are not terminated with a `.', like the top-level one is |
| 02:54:30 | <ski> | (oh, and yes, `pi' is universal quantification. its type is `(A -> o) -> o'. `o' is the type of propositions. `loop \ ..loop..', as well as `X \ ..X..', &c. are lambda terms) |
| 02:55:41 | <ski> | right, Unreal Engine |
| 02:55:53 | <ski> | ty for the Verse link |
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| 02:57:56 | <ski> | (Twelf is rather similar to lambdaProlog, apart from being dependently typed, and having a bunch of more features and static checking, related to theorem proving, termination checking, a rudimentary mode and determinism system, &c.) |
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| 02:59:34 | <ski> | "a new core calculus for deterministic functional logic programming" -- i wonder how this compares to Oz |
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| 03:02:52 | <ski> | btw, with `=>' (implication), you can do a kind of "dynamic scope", namely of predicate clauses. the goal `( <clause> => <goal> )' temporarily assumes (adds/asserts) `<clause>', for the duration of the solving / execution / solution-search of `<goal>'. when (if) that succeeds, the clause is removed. if we backtrack back inside, it is added again. if we fail back to before, it is removed |
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| 03:06:03 | <ski> | one can see the presence of goal implications (and also goal universal quantifications) as a kind of "completeness" of features, for effectively being able to reason about and manipulate lambda terms (as data, e.g. for HOAS). however, even without lambda terms, goal implication & universals can be quite handy and nice. iirc there's some "completeness" result that the Hereditary Harrop formulae, which is the |
| 03:06:09 | <ski> | analogue of Horn clauses for lambdaProlog (and Twelf), which inclused these two kinds of goals, is the largest class of formulae that can serve as an "abstract logic programming language", for intuitionistic logic |
| 03:06:56 | <ski> | being "abstract logic programming language" amounts to two properties, (a) goal-directedness; and (b) clause-focusing |
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| 03:08:47 | <ski> | goal-directedness means that every proof in the given system fragment, if the conclusion formula in the sequent is not atomic (so uses some connective), can be rewritten to an equivalent proof whose last inference rule is a right (introduction) rule for that connective |
| 03:10:27 | <ski> | clause-focusing means that every proof where the conclusion is atom, can be rewritten in such a way that we successively apply left (introduction) rules (from the root of the proof tree up) to a single chosen / focused clause, until we end up with an atomic clause (which them must unify with the atomic conclusion of the sequent) |
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| 03:11:54 | <ski> | these two properties means that we can cut away most of the non-determnism in the selection of which inference rules to apply. so that we can read a non-atomic goal as search instructions for how to execute the goal, not needing to consult any clause as long as the goal is non-atomic |
| 03:13:32 | <ski> | the latter property meaning that once the goal is atomic, it suffices to (non-deterministically) choose one clause to focus on, and then to continue reducing that (generating goals as extra side-conditions along the way), until we can determine that the clause matches the atomic goal (and we can execute the side-condition goals, the bodies of the clause) |
| 03:14:27 | <ski> | so, the latter means that we can treat predicate call goals as procedure invocations, and treat clauses as (partial) implementations of these |
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| 03:16:13 | <ski> | the remaining non-determinism, in the system, is in the choice of clause to focus on (and in the choice of which conjunct of a clause to focus on, e.g. in `( foo & bar ) :- baz.'), and in the choice of which disjunct in a disjunction goal to attempt to prove |
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| 03:18:52 | <ski> | technically, there's also non-determinism in the choice of which term to instantiate logic variables (as in existential goals, and universal clauses) to. but this can be dealt with, in the usual lazy fashion, delaying these choices until we need some equality to hold, by using unification (rather than backtracking or perhaps some other means to implement non-determinism, like some breadth-first or parallel |
| 03:18:58 | <ski> | exploration) |
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| 09:41:00 | <arahael> | I'm attempting to check for data in a pty, however, the only routines available are to actually block until I'm reading from it. I'm using spawnWithPty from System.Process.Pty. Is my only option to spawn a separate thread and do blocking stuff in that thread? |
| 09:42:25 | <arahael> | (And using forkOS at that) |
| 09:43:18 | <tomsmeding> | should be no need for forkOS, the GHC runtime is asynchronous under the hood anyway |
| 09:43:40 | <tomsmeding> | the ghc-haskell-ish way would indeed be to forkIO and block there |
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| 09:44:50 | <tomsmeding> | arahael: what would you do with the result of a check if data is currently available? Would you do polling? |
| 09:45:10 | <arahael> | Well, if there was data available, I'd be reading it. |
| 09:45:17 | <tomsmeding> | and if there wasn't? |
| 09:45:23 | <arahael> | If there is no data availabl,e I'd be querying something else and THEN checking if there's data. |
| 09:45:28 | <tomsmeding> | I see |
| 09:45:36 | <tomsmeding> | so your own scheduler? |
| 09:45:40 | <arahael> | Basically yes. |
| 09:45:46 | <tomsmeding> | the GHC RTS has a good scheduler :) |
| 09:45:53 | <arahael> | "If there's data on A, process A. Otherwise if there's data on B, process B. Repeat". |
| 09:46:14 | <arahael> | Hmm, so I'm inferring from your response that the blocking routines for these reads is not blocking the OS thread? |
| 09:46:19 | <tomsmeding> | yes |
| 09:46:39 | <tomsmeding> | start two forkIO threads to wait for data on A and B, and send the results on a Chan (Either MsgA MsgB) that you consume in a third forkIO thread |
| 09:46:57 | <arahael> | Awesome, that works then, how would I normally know, though, just from reading the code? I'm observing functions such as: threadWaitReadPty :: Pty -> IO () |
| 09:46:59 | <tomsmeding> | if you don't need to handle the messages centrally in one place you can handle them in the A and B threads immediately, of course |
| 09:47:14 | <tomsmeding> | arahael: in principle, _nothing_ in the GHC RTS blocks the OS thread |
| 09:47:25 | <tomsmeding> | there are exceptions: foreign calls block |
| 09:47:33 | <tomsmeding> | "unsafe" foreign calls, that is |
| 09:47:35 | <arahael> | Ah, so if it were to block the OS thread, it should be very very strongly called out in the documentation, then? |
| 09:47:40 | <tomsmeding> | yes |
| 09:47:42 | <arahael> | Excellent. |
| 09:47:49 | <tomsmeding> | if it isn't, file a bug :p |
| 09:47:53 | <arahael> | :P |
| 09:48:54 | <tomsmeding> | arahael: there is one pernicious thing that blocks an OS thread in GHC haskell: a tight loop that doesn't allocate |
| 09:49:21 | <tomsmeding> | scheduler yields occur on allocation, so if you have a tight loop that doesn't allocate, it doesn't yield and it doesn't relinquish the OS thread |
| 09:49:30 | <arahael> | I've heard about that. |
| 09:49:33 | <tomsmeding> | (the runtime is kind of cooperatively scheduled) |
| 09:49:38 | <arahael> | Yeah, makes sense. |
| 09:49:50 | <tomsmeding> | iirc there's an option to GHC that makes it insert more yields |
| 09:49:59 | <tomsmeding> | if you suspect that this is causing you pain |
| 09:50:13 | <arahael> | I think I can cross that bridge if I ever get to it, I think what I needed now was to sort of learn the more typical conventions, so you've been very helpful. |
| 09:50:20 | <tomsmeding> | yay :) |
| 09:51:40 | <tomsmeding> | this one https://downloads.haskell.org/ghc/latest/docs/users_guide/using-optimisation.html#ghc-flag-fomit-yields |
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| 09:52:08 | <arahael> | Ah, cool. |
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| 09:56:00 | <tomsmeding> | there are also some operations on the haskell level that are "non-interruptible" ( https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.21.0.0/docs/Control-Exception.html#g:12 ), which can be important if you do tricky things with concurrency and exceptions (and MVars, mostly) |
| 09:56:20 | <tomsmeding> | but they are non-interruptible _on the haskell level_, meaning that you need to reach for heavier-handed exception machinery to interrupt them |
| 09:56:30 | <tomsmeding> | they still don't block the OS thread on the scheduler level |
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| 09:57:50 | <arahael> | Nice, I'm not expecting to do anything 'tricky' at this stage. |
| 09:57:59 | <tomsmeding> | cool, then you should forget about this particular bit :p |
| 09:58:11 | <arahael> | And if I am, then I'll be re-asking here to figure out what I'm doing wrong. :P |
| 09:58:16 | <tomsmeding> | please do |
| 09:58:28 | trickard_ | is now known as trickard |
| 09:58:44 | <arahael> | Been ages since I've been here, actually, been out of the haskell space for a while. I miss it. |
| 09:59:09 | <tomsmeding> | I hope you enjoy being here :) |
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| 10:00:31 | <arahael> | I am. :) It's so refreshing. |
| 10:00:37 | <arahael> | Nice having a real type system again. |
| 10:01:35 | <tomsmeding> | just looked at that suspiciously named threadWaitRead function; I'm 99% sure the "thread" referred to there is the Haskell-level forkIO thread |
| 10:02:09 | <tomsmeding> | a few functions deep you end up here https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.14.0.0/docs/src/GHC.Event.Thread.html#threadWait |
| 10:02:09 | <arahael> | Ah, good. |
| 10:02:20 | <arahael> | I was confused why I couldn't get the handle from it, though. |
| 10:02:26 | <arahael> | (getFd is not exported in that module) |
| 10:02:31 | <tomsmeding> | which seems to implement the actual waiting by registering a callback on some kind of event; that callback does a putMVar, and the actual waiting is a takeMVar |
| 10:03:22 | <tomsmeding> | yeah good question |
| 10:04:07 | <tomsmeding> | maaybe to have future compatibility with platforms where a pty is not a file descriptor? |
| 10:04:18 | <tomsmeding> | but then the "Portability" field at the top of the docs has value "haha"... :p |
| 10:04:22 | <Franciman> | ski: can we have ontological modelling in haskell? |
| 10:04:24 | <arahael> | I did notice that. :P |
| 10:09:11 | <tomsmeding> | @tell merijn why did you make the Pty type in posix-pty abstract, i.e. why does the user have no ability to get the underlying Fd? (tell arahael your answer) |
| 10:09:11 | <lambdabot> | Consider it noted. |
| 10:09:43 | <arahael> | Thanks! :) |
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| 12:58:48 | <DavidSch__> | Hi, I've recently started working through the book "Programming in Haskell", 2nd edition, by Graham Hutton. It's style is definitely great. Just to make sure, it's also still reasonably up-to-date, right? |
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| 13:11:35 | <__monty__> | As far as books are concerned, I do think so. There's only one that I know is more recent. |
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| 14:37:20 | <DavidSch__> | __monty__: cool, thanks! |
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| 16:59:09 | <slondr> | ok I got lsp to launch haskell-language-server correctly I think, but now it always reports an error at character 0 of the file that just says "(GetStanDiagnostics,NormalizedFilePath" |
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| 17:00:58 | <slondr> | it seems like the hls-wrapper wants to run 9.10 instead of 9.6 ? |
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| 17:05:37 | <slondr> | is there a way to tell hls-wrapper to use a specific hls version? |
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| 17:13:10 | <slondr> | actually, what version of hls should I even be using? I tried reinstalling 2.10 using ghcup but I still ended up with it compiled using ghc 9.10 even though my ghc is 9.6 |
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| 17:15:25 | <geekosaur> | that's not precise enough: minor versions matter. 2.10 supports 9.6.1-6 but not 9.6.7 because the ghc-api changed (as yet, it's not stable even across major versions) |
| 17:16:39 | <slondr> | yeah I'm just getting "ghcide compiled against GHC 9.10.1 but currently using 9.6.7 This is unsupported, ghcide must be compiled with the same GHC version as the project." when I try to run it |
| 17:16:58 | <geekosaur> | also, hls doesn't pick a ghc, it tries to use whichever one your project uses by figuring out if you're using cabal or stack and asking that, otherwise using whatever it finds first in $PATH |
| 17:17:43 | <slondr> | So maybe my problem is that GHCup compiled hls using a ghc version that isn't the version on my path/set in GHCup? |
| 17:18:17 | <geekosaur> | that sounds like haskell-language-server-wrapper is picking the wrong HLS (ghc-ide is a component of HLS) |
| 17:18:40 | <slondr> | I agree; is there a way to change which HLS is picked by HLS-wrapper? |
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| 17:21:23 | <geekosaur> | the right way to do it is to switch to HLS 2.11, which supports ghc 9.6.7. but I thought HLS-=wrapper just faield to start if it didn't find a matching binary, here it sounds like it's just trying the newest HLS binary present which is just wrong |
| 17:23:41 | <slondr> | I was just on all the "recommended" versions of everything in GHCup, if I switch to "latest" everything should I expect that to work? |
| 17:24:36 | <geekosaur> | wait, I keep forgetting 2.10 does support 9.6.7 |
| 17:24:46 | <geekosaur> | so I have no idea why the wrapper isn't selecting it |
| 17:25:45 | <geekosaur> | do you have ~/.ghcup/bin/haskell-language-server-9.6.7-2.10.0.0? |
| 17:26:54 | <slondr> | yes (it's a ~ not a - but otherwise yes) |
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| 17:30:50 | <geekosaur> | weird |
| 17:30:53 | <geekosaur> | (not the ~) |
| 17:31:08 | <geekosaur> | I think at this point you need to ask over in #haskell-language-server |
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| 17:33:55 | <tomsmeding> | slondr: have you tried running 'haskell-language-server-wrapper' in a terminal and seeing what it prints? |
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| 17:34:34 | <tomsmeding> | Do you perhaps have a stack.yaml in the directory too but want to use cabal, and the stack.yaml specifies a different GHC version (via the snapshot) than your cabal project? |
| 17:34:47 | <slondr> | I'm just in a directory with a single .hs file nothing else |
| 17:35:12 | <tomsmeding> | ah |
| 17:35:30 | <tomsmeding> | then the first thing I said |
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| 17:35:45 | <tomsmeding> | if you're not sure whether that outputs something relevant, paste the output in a pastebin (see /topic) |
| 17:35:47 | <slondr> | Running h-l-s-wrapper doesn't report any obvious errors, it prints a bunch of stuff but looks fine? |
| 17:36:06 | <tomsmeding> | what ghc version does it select? And is that the same version as you get reported in your editor? |
| 17:36:17 | <geekosaur> | ctly is it printing? (use paste.tomsmeding.com) |
| 17:36:35 | tomsmeding | . o O ( "ctly"? ) |
| 17:37:14 | <int-e> | I'd guess "what exactly" |
| 17:37:29 | <geekosaur> | whoops, yes |
| 17:37:34 | <int-e> | no clue how it got cut off like that though |
| 17:37:36 | <geekosaur> | I keep fatfingering ctrl and a |
| 17:37:51 | <geekosaur> | (I got up unusually early this morning and it shows) |
| 17:37:59 | <tomsmeding> | you have ctrl on capslock? |
| 17:38:08 | <geekosaur> | yeh, because I'm ancient |
| 17:38:22 | <slondr> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/IZI6qrQg |
| 17:38:26 | <tomsmeding> | no need to use that excuse, I know very young people who do that too :p (I don't though) |
| 17:38:44 | <slondr> | I have Compose on caps lock :) |
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| 17:39:11 | <tomsmeding> | slondr: that... looks very innocuous |
| 17:39:20 | <tomsmeding> | it just selects HLS for GHC 9.6.7 and it works |
| 17:39:40 | <geekosaur> | right, that works right apparently |
| 17:39:57 | <geekosaur> | hm, do you have a stray ghc-ide somewhere on your PATH? |
| 17:40:18 | <tomsmeding> | slondr: how have you set up HLS in your editor? Have you, perchance, told it to start h-l-s-9.10.1 specifically? Or that ^ I guess |
| 17:40:26 | <geekosaur> | er, ghcide |
| 17:42:05 | <tomsmeding> | also, what editor are you using, and does that editor have the same $PATH as in a terminal? |
| 17:42:11 | <slondr> | All I did was install lsp-haskell and run lsp in a .hs file. I haven't configured anything else in particular |
| 17:42:35 | <tomsmeding> | your editor does not magically know about "haskell-language-server" |
| 17:42:53 | <tomsmeding> | you may have a plugin in your editor that knows about it and has lain dormant until now |
| 17:43:09 | <slondr> | oh to be clear lsp-haskell is a package for my editor |
| 17:43:16 | <slondr> | https://github.com/emacs-lsp/lsp-haskell |
| 17:43:35 | <tomsmeding> | looks like that starts h-l-s-wrapper |
| 17:43:50 | <tomsmeding> | is the lsp-haskell-server-path still on the default value? |
| 17:44:18 | <slondr> | yep it's "haskell-language-server-wrapper" |
| 17:44:34 | <geekosaur> | is there some reasom you're not using the built-in eglot? |
| 17:44:55 | tomsmeding | will defer to people who actually know something about emacs |
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| 17:45:35 | <geekosaur> | I only know a little bit more, but eglot's supposed to be pretty good these days (originally it wasn't and people used other solutions) |
| 17:45:44 | <slondr> | lsp::log shows that it's starting haskell-language-server-wrapper with log output to ../hls.log |
| 17:45:56 | <geekosaur> | (I switched to codium) |
| 17:46:25 | <slondr> | geekosaur: I prefer lsp's output and interactions to eglot generally |
| 17:47:09 | <tomsmeding> | slondr: cool, is there anything relevant in that hls.log? |
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| 17:50:39 | <slondr> | https://paste.tomsmeding.com/S5NDK1ZO |
| 17:50:56 | <slondr> | I don't think so? nothing jumps out as an obvious error to mee at least. I'm not even seeing the error reported in my haskell buffer here |
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| 17:54:05 | <slondr> | ok this is really weird actually. some lsp features are totally working! when I mouse over functions I see their docs in a pop-up, when I mouse over definitions it shows me their inferred types. all that is working. it's just also randomly giving me this critical error on line 1 character 1 with a nonsense error message |
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| 17:55:56 | <slondr> | I do *not* get this error with eglot, which does imply that this is a problem with lsp-haskell and not with HLS itself |
| 17:56:04 | <slondr> | Hmmmmmmmmmmm |
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| 18:02:41 | <slondr> | well I filed a bug report with lsp-haskell: https://github.com/emacs-lsp/lsp-haskell/issues/201 we'll see what they say |
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| 18:11:32 | <haskellbridge> | <geekosaur> Fwiw that looks like lsp-haskell is mis-parsing HLS output |
| 18:19:35 | <[exa]> | evenin' guys |
| 18:19:50 | <[exa]> | hows your thunks |
| 18:22:55 | <Rembane> | Evening! They're thunking! |
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| 20:47:45 | <ski> | Franciman : i haven't looked much into ontological stuff |
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| 21:22:22 | <Lycurgus> | Franciman, no reason y not but most stuff that does isn, its outside the hs cultural pale |
| 21:22:48 | <Lycurgus> | my main SUMO thing of choice e.g. is lisp |
| 21:26:54 | <Lycurgus> | (that got ported to java in a depressingly common move, i wish ppl didn do that) |
| 21:27:42 | <Lycurgus> | but there's no one lang for onto stuffs |
| 21:28:18 | <Lycurgus> | there's protege but it's lang agnostic and just a very popular workframe |
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| 21:28:39 | <Lycurgus> | most things of interest to me are prolog or lisp |
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| 21:31:09 | <Lycurgus> | the protege plugins are a good sampler |
| 21:31:15 | <Lycurgus> | lang wise |
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| 21:36:09 | <Lycurgus> | that thing wasn ported from lisp, sounded wrong and confabulatied from lisp like dsl |
| 21:36:25 | <Lycurgus> | it actually uses a jvm based prolof |
| 21:36:30 | <Lycurgus> | *prolog |
| 21:38:00 | <Lycurgus> | curry would maybe be a better choice than straight hs if ur starting a new world |
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| 21:42:33 | <Lycurgus> | there's onto-ish hs stuff like wordnet libs |
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All times are in UTC on 2025-09-07.