Logs on 2026-03-01 (liberachat/#haskell)
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| 02:19:18 | <probie> | :t \f x -> f <$> sequence x |
| 02:19:19 | <lambdabot> | (Traversable t, Monad f) => (t a -> b) -> t (f a) -> f b |
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| 02:20:12 | <probie> | :t \f -> traverse (fmap f) |
| 02:20:13 | <lambdabot> | (Traversable t, Applicative f) => (a -> b) -> t (f a) -> f (t b) |
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| 02:21:54 | <EvanR> | /o\ |
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| 02:40:57 | <Leary> | What would be required would be for `fmap f` to be an applicative homomorphism/transformation, which holds iff `f = id`. |
| 02:41:33 | <Leary> | tomsmeding: If `f` is a fold: |
| 02:41:42 | <Leary> | :t \g x -> foldMap g <$> sequenceA x |
| 02:41:43 | <lambdabot> | (Monoid b, Traversable t, Applicative f) => (a -> b) -> t (f a) -> f b |
| 02:41:52 | <Leary> | :t \g -> getAp . foldMap (Ap . fmap g) |
| 02:41:53 | <lambdabot> | (Foldable t, Applicative f, Monoid a1) => (a2 -> a1) -> t (f a2) -> f a1 |
| 02:42:07 | <Leary> | Then you can fuse the sequence in. ^ |
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| 07:14:43 | <haskellbridge> | <alexfmpe> * id) |
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| 10:32:20 | <Milan_Vanca> | Hello guyz, not sure if I found bug in library or I am just dumb but for import Text.Regex.TDFA and these equations "aaa" =~ "[a]{1,3}" -> True, "a]a" =~ "[a\\]]{1,3}" -> True, "aaa" =~ "[a\\]]{1,3}" -> False |
| 10:32:38 | <Milan_Vanca> | The last one should also produce True? |
| 10:33:51 | <opqdonut> | I don't know about Text.Regex.TDFA in particular, but in most regex implementations you need to write that character class as []a] |
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| 10:34:50 | <opqdonut> | note that =~ checks if any match is found, it doesn't necesarily match the whole string |
| 10:35:12 | <Milan_Vanca> | Yeah I think I see now. |
| 10:35:28 | <opqdonut> | I think what might be happening is that "a]a" =~ "[a\\]]{1,3}" is really matching "[a]]{1,3}", that is, "a]" |
| 10:35:53 | <Milan_Vanca> | Yeah..probably I am going to test ^$ |
| 10:36:44 | <Milan_Vanca> | You are right using ^$ produces False. Now it all makes sense |
| 10:36:58 | <opqdonut> | regex-tdfa says it implements posix extended regexes, which need []a] |
| 10:37:42 | <opqdonut> | regex(7) says: To include a literal ']' in the list, make it the first character |
| 10:38:59 | <Milan_Vanca> | Lets say I need to also include literals - ^ \ then it should look like "[]a-z^\\-]" |
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| 10:39:11 | <mauke> | this is why every regex library written after ~2000 ignores posix and just does what perl does |
| 10:39:32 | <Milan_Vanca> | ] must be first - must be last, \ must be escaped and ^ must not be first |
| 10:39:40 | <opqdonut> | yep, pretty trippy |
| 10:40:02 | <mauke> | \ must be escaped in Haskell strings, but does not need to be escaped in [ ] |
| 10:40:27 | <mauke> | that is, posix is fine with []\-], but in Haskell you need to write it as "[]\\-]" |
| 10:40:27 | <Milan_Vanca> | mauke: True, I was in implicit haskell context |
| 10:41:41 | <Milan_Vanca> | mauke: so I should not use TDFA? which lib then? |
| 10:42:02 | <mauke> | I'm not saying you shouldn't use it, I'm just saying that posix regex syntax is bizarre :-) |
| 10:42:26 | <Milan_Vanca> | opqdonut: Thank you very much, your insight helped me to see my wrong assumption |
| 10:45:07 | <Milan_Vanca> | Yes this unescaped ] as first char is crazy. It screams syntax error in my view :D |
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| 10:46:01 | <probie> | If you want PCRE behaviour, use one of the PCRE libraries |
| 10:46:22 | <mauke> | I don't necessarily need PCRE behavior, just perl-style syntax |
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| 10:46:50 | <mauke> | it's so much cleaner |
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| 12:46:20 | <__monty__> | It's such a kludge "An empty character class doesn't make any sense so the closing character can occur in the first position without ambiguity." |
| 12:46:49 | <__monty__> | Kinda love it from a semantics point of view but hate the readability. |
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| 16:55:22 | <geekosaur> | sadly, it's grandfathered behavior. so is the same behavior for `-` |
| 16:55:45 | <geekosaur> | people hate regex for a reason ☺ |
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| 18:26:40 | <Milan_Vanca> | I don't know they should be more simple than "programming languges". Maybe we are just not used to them. And maybe writing whole "program" in one line without indentation is the problem. |
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| 18:30:06 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> standard regular expressions are meant to be compact and powerful. (And their syntax predates most of us, so I cut them some slack.) You can always use a DSL or regex flavour that lets you write more verbosely. |
| 18:31:04 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I don't know how a unix user could really hate regex |
| 18:31:45 | <Milan_Vanca> | Anyway here https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.12.0.0/docs/src/Text.ParserCombinators.ReadP.html#ReadP is ReadP defined with "newtype" but in documentation it shows "data" https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.12.0.0/docs/Text-ParserCombinators-ReadP.html#t:ReadP |
| 18:32:20 | ski | . o O ( "IrRegular Expressions" by foof at <https://synthcode.com/scheme/irregex/> ) |
| 18:32:24 | ski | . o O ( "Regular Expression Matching Can Be Simple And Fast (but is slow in Java, Perl, PHP, Python, Ruby, ...)" by Russ Cox in 2007-01 at <https://swtch.com/~rsc/regexp/regexp1.html> ) |
| 18:32:38 | <Milan_Vanca> | sm: I don't think people hate regexes |
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| 18:32:48 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> https://www.regular-expressions.info is also excellent |
| 18:34:57 | <EvanR> | after seeing a lot of other nice looking languages, regex makes my head hurt |
| 18:35:05 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> s/also// |
| 18:35:26 | <EvanR> | they are (potentially) small so I can fit 2000 of them on my screen? no thanks! |
| 18:36:00 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> compactness can be a virtue |
| 18:36:02 | <EvanR> | they also have come up less since I learned about parser combinators |
| 18:36:22 | <EvanR> | something might be parsable using an extension to regex... but why |
| 18:36:26 | <Milan_Vanca> | EvanR: Hehe :D vim can also soft linewrap |
| 18:37:13 | <EvanR> | APL code has the same compaction, it's so small it occupies the top left 2% of my screen |
| 18:37:23 | <EvanR> | virtuous! |
| 18:37:52 | <Milan_Vanca> | Imagine binary encoded as RGB bitmap... |
| 18:37:55 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> C can too! https://needleful.net/blog/2024/01/arthur_whitney.html :) |
| 18:38:31 | <EvanR> | Milan_Vanca, a fun exercise in SDL or raylib etc |
| 18:38:47 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> and of course so can Haskell https://github.com/haskell-game/tiny-games-hs |
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| 18:42:23 | <EvanR> | the tiny game jam was kind of amazing |
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| 18:47:31 | <monochrom> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/regex-applicative has nicer syntax. (You just use Alternative operators!) |
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| 18:52:41 | <EvanR> | hold on... were the names of empty, many, some, and <|> based on regex |
| 18:52:53 | <c_wraith> | they were based on parsing, more broadly |
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| 18:55:52 | <monochrom> | They came from all over the places. many, some, <|> are clearly from parsing and regex. You would then like to say "fail" for the identity of <|>, but "fail" is already taken, so the analogy went sideways and if you think of <|> as set union then its identity is the empty set. (Clearly, it is not the empty string.) |
| 18:56:05 | <c_wraith> | but yes, it was realized pretty early on that applicative+alternative gives you context-free grammars |
| 18:56:14 | <EvanR> | E = empty | just Char | E <> E | E <|> E | many E, "these are the only ways to construct a regular expression --conway" xD |
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| 19:02:22 | <monochrom> | It has been already mzero for MonadPlus, so maybe we could have called it azero. |
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All times are in UTC on 2026-03-01.