Home liberachat/#xmonad: Logs Calendar

Logs on 2021-06-04 (liberachat/#xmonad)

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00:17:49 <jg> how goes it :) how was y'alls day?
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03:01:10 <jg> yo
03:01:14 <jg> whats good
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03:22:12 <electr0n> 'lo
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05:39:48 Solid is currently debating whether he should doxx himself in MAINTIANERS.md
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06:56:04 <Solid> sigh, I think this Choose business is hopeless
06:57:08 <Solid> the problem is that (|||)'s signature really is `forall l r a. l a -> r a -> Choose l r a` and so what we would acutally need to do for a `Gen (Choose l r a)` or similar is to generate an arbitrary type that we could feed to `generate`
06:57:19 <Solid> which is a thing quickcheck can't do
06:57:26 <Solid> :/
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07:58:57 <liskin> You can just define a new type for binary trees and generate those and convert to Choose
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08:00:22 <liskin> There will be existential and/or dynamic types though
08:00:35 <liskin> I didn't think of that before
08:03:02 <Solid> yeah I think with a conversion function you run into the same issues
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15:47:22 <Solid> liskin: I'll squash the fixup commits in #281 for now; I don't see a way to nicely property test this with quickcheck :/
15:47:52 <Solid> we could still add unit tests for the most obvious things (jumping to the same layout, having a non-trivial choose tree, etc.)
15:55:01 <liskin> Solid: what do you mean by "for now"? are we going to try again later or shall we just merge it without tests?
15:55:37 <liskin> I'm probably fine with merging it without tests now that I understand that we'd need something close to dependent types to write them
15:55:49 <liskin> and I'm reasonably certain the code we ended up with works
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16:04:40 <Solid> liskin: by "for now" I mean I wasn't going to merge it or anything crazy in case we want to add tests
16:04:49 <Solid> maybe I just wanted to use a filler word... :>
16:07:18 <liskin> we might as well merge it though
16:07:42 <liskin> if we want to add unit tests we'd need to do the same hspec refactor that was done in xmonad-contrib
16:08:00 <Solid> oh right, that wasn't done for the core so far
16:08:04 <liskin> which would be nice but it might take a couple hours
16:08:26 <liskin> and I'm very very close to the EWMH thing
16:08:40 <liskin> so I should really not come close to any of that :-)
16:09:12 <liskin> (and also I'm very close to the weekend :-/)
16:10:10 <Solid> I'll put it on my TODO list as well (but I'm quite busy with applications right now, so I can't really promise anyhting in the next few weeks either :/)
16:10:35 <liskin> phd study applications?
16:10:56 <Solid> yes
16:11:06 <liskin> good luck with those then :-)
16:11:12 <Solid> thanks! :)
16:11:40 <Solid> so many statements to write why I positively, definitely want exactly that position
16:11:53 <liskin> :-D
16:12:16 <Solid> and of course everything has to be accompanied by a research _and_ teaching statement in which I just repeat things from the cover letter in more detail
16:12:19 <Solid> lots of fun :P
16:13:04 <Solid> anyways, if we want to merge #281 then we'll probably want to do the same for the associated contrib pr, otherwise there'll be lots of CI failures for new PRs
16:13:29 <liskin> yep, I'll keep that in mind
16:13:49 <liskin> my shiny new xmonad-testing Makefile will help me make sure that I don't fuck it up
16:15:03 <liskin> (one would expect the CI to lend a hand, but https://github.com/haskell/cabal/issues/6888 makes it harder than expected)
16:17:59 <liskin> I wonder why the academic world is still stuck in this weird power dynamic of having young ambitious people full of energy waste time on writing long bullshit letters
16:18:37 <liskin> on the other hand, the commercial world of young ambitious women spamming people on linkedin isn't much better I guess
16:22:04 <Solid> I think it's partly to keep up appearances tbh
16:23:15 <Solid> I can't speak for other countries of course, but over here like 75% of all announcements for PhD positions are phony
16:23:33 <Solid> in the sense that the prof already has a candidate, but these positions _have_ to be publicly announced in some way
16:23:50 <Solid> so they make it ultra-specific such that exactly one person fits the description of what they're looking for
16:27:22 <liskin> sounds like the best way to play that game is to also get to be friends with the prof first
16:28:10 <liskin> (a bit harder now in the pandemic though)
16:29:04 <Solid> ah, the probem is when the prof you really want to work with doesn't have any money right now
16:29:23 <Solid> we're in the process of writing a grant together but I'm not sure if that'll be done and reviewed by the fall
16:29:50 <liskin> oh, money :-/
16:30:18 <Solid> especially during the pandemic people aren't keen to spend lots of money on theoretical endeavours :(
16:30:45 <Solid> so I need to find some failsafe positions that I can still comfortably quit after half a year should we get the grant
16:32:24 <liskin> not entirely sure how exactly it works in my country, but I think it's something like the university pays a stipend (which is very little, but enough to share a room and still have some for food and drinks) and then if the prof can get a grant, you get extra money, and if not, then not
16:33:12 <liskin> my wife lived off the stipend alone for the first 4 years, and then off teaching at the centre for students with special ends for another 3 years
16:34:28 <liskin> *student with special needs
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16:37:16 <Solid> mh interesting
16:37:48 <Solid> I think you have the option to start the phd completely pro bono and just pay for it yourself
16:37:54 <Solid> (I don't have that money however)
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16:39:14 <Solid> for anything else though you either need a grant or your advisor needs to pay you with money that he gets for research assistants (though in my case he's already keeping two post-docs with that money)
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17:29:01 <liskin> shall I bump xmonad version to help people not get confused about compile errors when they only update xmonad-contrib but not xmonad?
17:29:27 <liskin> and if yes, do we go the Don Knuth way of adding more decimal digits or just .1 at the end? :-)
17:29:46 <liskin> the former might be fun
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17:57:16 <Solid> I think that would be nice yeah
17:57:30 <Solid> there are a surprising number of people who are on the git version(s)
17:58:45 <Solid> I don't really mind concerning the numbering
17:58:48 <Solid> numbers are evil anyways :)
17:59:09 <liskin> what do mathematicians use instead of numbers these days?
17:59:33 <Solid> categories of course!
18:00:16 <Solid> you can get through a graduate course in mathematics with just the numbers 1-10 ez :P
18:01:17 <liskin> is that why Haskell PVP uses two components for the major version instead of just one like SemVer?
18:03:40 <Solid> that would be pretty funny
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18:05:34 <liskin> okay so we're at four nines now
18:05:58 <liskin> and the xmonad 0.17 board is looking really good
18:06:05 <liskin> this was a good week :-)
18:07:34 <Solid> oh wow
18:07:37 <Solid> almost done! :)
18:11:15 <liskin> yeah, just the EWMH stuff
18:12:41 <liskin> and the various docs
18:17:54 <liskin> oh, and deprecations!
18:18:21 <liskin> I'd really like to make deprecation warnings visible before the release
18:21:00 <Solid> oh right
18:21:12 <Solid> we still need to decide what to do with that
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19:51:09 <davve> shouldnt xmonad be bumped to 1.x? seems pretty stable to me :P
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22:03:53 <liskin> mc47: I've made the leap to dynamicSBs https://github.com/liskin/dotfiles/commit/168775b0fcfb6f8d1c2191e7b868e5b636988401?w=1 :-)
22:05:15 <liskin> mc47: if you ever see xmobar not getting killed, try this: https://github.com/liskin/xmonad-contrib/commit/80918a1488a3323cb54e1853c0030eec347c16d6
22:05:41 <liskin> I don't really know why it happens, but it used to happen here like once a week or something :-/
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22:16:13 <mc47> liskin that's awesome \o/
22:16:21 <mc47> It has been a pretty good week tbh, kudos
22:17:13 <mc47> I never had the xmobar problem though, it's pretty odd that you have it
22:17:43 <liskin> it is indeed
22:18:03 <liskin> more so that I didn't have it for like 5 years
22:18:14 <liskin> or I don't know how long I had those dynamic bars
22:18:29 <liskin> and then suddenly one week it started happening
22:24:03 <mc47> at least it's cool that you can hide the patch inside X.H.StatusBar
22:25:12 <mc47> and I have to agree with davve, why didn't a 1.x version ever see the light?
22:25:18 <mc47> is there even a versioning policy?
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22:29:04 <allbery_b> habit, I think. we could have gone 1.0 with the 0.9 release
22:29:08 <liskin> xmonad governance in general is quite chaotic, so no, there's absolutely no versioning policy
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22:30:27 <liskin> I wonder why no one ever complained that the X11 library doesn't follow PVP
22:30:39 <mc47> yeah, it's not like it's a pressing matter
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22:38:27 <geekosaur> I think there's like only one other consumer of X11
22:42:43 <geekosaur> enh, packdeps/reverse claims there's a few more that aren't xmonad/xmobar-related
23:01:13 <liskin> quite a few
23:12:12 <geekosaur> many of the packages it brings up are things like X11-xft which then only have a few deps. and half the others are dead anyway (who uses bluetile?)
23:17:33 <liskin> I used it last week :-)
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All times are in UTC on 2021-06-04.